# tstraub's learning prop controllers



## tstraub

I have designed 2 low cost prop controllers and would like to share the design with fellow haunters.

Both controllers have relay outputs and can switch AC or DC loads up to 5 amps per channel. The relays have both NO and NC outputs so they can switch the load on of off while active. Once you build and flash the microchip with the correct firmware all you need to do is press the record button then press the channel buttons in whatever order you want to activate your prop. The sequence is saved to the EEPROM section of the micro controller so it will retain the sequence even after the power is removed. Sequences are played back when an external trigger is activated. Trigger can be a PIR sensor, magnetic reed switch, press button, step mat, ect.

The First one is a 2 channel controller and cost to build is about $5. The second one has four channels and optional MP3 audio. The 4 channel controller can be built for around $10 without the MP3 board or $20 with the MP3.















These designs are DIY and do require special tools to etch the PCBs and flash the micro controllers. Attached are the etch files created in Eagle 6.1 and firmware.

View attachment 4ch learning controller.zip
View attachment 2ch learning controller.zip


Here is a short demo video of the 4 channel board in action.






*4 channel controller operation guide:*

*How to prepare the SD card*

You will need a total of 4 mp3 tracks on the SD card for proper operation. I will provide the 2 files used in the setup menu you are responsible to come up with your own ambient and scare track. The files I provide are ones named 003.mp3 and 004.mp3 discuses in the next part of this procedure. These files are to large to attach here so I will send them to you in an email when you place an order for PCBs or flashed chips. If you choose to etch your own PCBs and flash you own chips shoot me a PM with an email address to send the files to.

1 Choose whatever MP3 you want to use as an ambient sound track and rename it to 001.mp3.

2 Choose an MP3 to use as your scare track and rename it to 002.mp3.

3 Format your SD card to FAT32 file system.

4 One at a time drag all 4 MP3 files to the SDcard starting with 001 and ending with 004

All four files must be on the SD card for the controller to work correctly. If you prefer to not have an ambient sound track you need to create or download an MP3 that contains only silence and use it as your ambient track. This will trick the controller into thinking it is playing a sound file but no sound will come out the speakers.

*To record a new sequence do the following.*

1 Unplug any external trigger device from the controller.

2 Make sure it is in the non triggered state(The recording LED will be off and the ambient sound track will be playing)

3 Press and release the record button(The ambient sound track will stop playing)

4 After about 1 second the scare track will begin to play and the LED will come on (this is your cue to start pressing the button to record a new sequence

5 when you are finished recording your sequence press and hold the record button release the button as soon as you see the Recording LED go off.

*To enter the setup menu and change the max record time and or re trigger delay*

1 Unplug any external trigger device from the controller.

2 Make sure it is in the non triggered state(The recording LED will be off and the ambient sound track will be playing)

3 Press and hold button #3 for 3 seconds release the button when you hear the sequence length MP3 file start playing

4 Make your selection by pressing one of the number button

5 You should hear the re-trigger delay selection MP3 start

6 Make you selection and then press the record button to exit the setup menu. 1=1 minute 2=2 minutes 3=4 minutes and 4= 8 minutes. These times can be added together for a total of 15 minutes. example if you want a 5 minute delay before it can be triggered again after each trigger event you would press and release the 3 button for 4 minutes(the LED will flash 4 times to confirm the 4 minute timer is set. Then press the 1 button to add one minute to the previously selected 4 minutes. The LED will flash once to confirm the 1 minute timer is set. Then press and release the record button to exit out to the main program. If you don't want any trigger delay set just don't press any of the numbers to enable timers. Simply press the record to exit.

*Notes about changing things in the setup menu:*

Longer sequence lengths will slow down the speed that the controller checks the buttons in the record mode. At 4 minutes sequence length it can take up to 1/2 second to register a button press or release this is due to the limited size of space available to store the sequence info and is considered normal operation.

When the controller is in the trigger delay loop it will not respond to any button presses until the delay has expired. You will not be able to record new sequences or enter the setup menu until the timer runs out. If it's in the delay and you don't want to wait for the time to expire unhook it from it's power source for a few seconds and it will restart in the untriggered state so you can record a new sequence or enter the setup menu again.

The trigger delay can be changed at anytime before or after you record your sequence. changing the delay will not effect previously recorded sequences. The sequence length must be set before recording you sequence. If you try to playback a sequence at a different speed than it was recorded the timings will not be played back correctly.

*Adjusting the Volume*

The volume can be adjusted by pressing the #1 and #2 buttons anytime the controller is in an untriggered state and the trigger delay timer has expired. This will adjust the volume of all 4 soundtracks at the same time. If you are having issues with one track to loud or to quiet you need to normalize the MP3 files themselves there are several free programs available to do this. Google is your friend.

*Using an external trigger*

The 3 pin header next to button #4 is for an external trigger. It can be used for a PIR sensor, magnetic reed switch, mercury tilt switch, remote push button, ect. The SIG pin shares a I/O port on the micro controller with button #4. The controller will trigger when the SIG pin is pulled high or button #4 is pressed. You need to unplug any external trigger during the sequence record process or you could get false button presses on channel #4.

You can also choose to not use an external trigger and have the controller trigger one its own at a set time interval. To do this record you sequence as described above and set you trigger delay time to the desired time between trigger events. Then simply place a shunt on the + and SIG pins of the trigger header


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## Palmdale Haunter

The costs seem so low...
Have you considered getting boards produced and selling them?


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## tstraub

I think its too late to get anything done for this year. I simply do not have the time or cash to make it happen right now. If interest is high enough I might consider something in the spring. What are you looking for? PCB only, PCB and micro with firmware installed, complete solder yourself kit, assembled unit? The more work people are capable of doing themselves the greater the savings but I would not be opposed to flashing PICs for a low fee to save someone from buying a PICkit just to flash one or to chips. 

I'm not guaranteeing anything in the lines of a group buy but I'm open to considering it for the good of the community.

I think Halstaff has PCB's for his button banger available now. It's a similar design(mine is somewhat a copy of his). Cost to build is comparable the major difference is his requires a PICaxe download cable to flash the chip and this one requires a PICkit. 

Tyler


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## Wildcat

Seems like a great little board. I'd be interested in a kit with PCB, parts and flashed chip.


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## Palmdale Haunter

I will look at Halstaff's at your recomendation... 
If you were going to package these then a PCB, flashed PIC and a bill of materials from some place like mouser would be great if not a kit of parts would be good...
I would really like to have a unit with audio and control like the second one you mention above. My real desire would be a controller that would have ambient audio and controller (relay and servo) track that would work off a triggger to run a set of tracks and then could be interrupted by and act as a DMX interface to run a coordinated show... Oh, and it should cost no more than $100.00 out the door...


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## tstraub

oh, Sorry I forgot to post the BOM. I try to buy from taydaelectronics.com whenever possible. There part selection is not a good as mouser but the prices are great shipping is low cost and reasonably fast(usually about a week or so). here is a list of the parts I used on the 4 channel version of the board.



Code:


Parts sourced from Taydaelectronics.com

 Product Name						Unit Price	Qty	Subtotal	 
DG301 Screw Terminal Block 3 Positions 5mm		$0.15		 4	 $0.60	
DG301 Screw Terminal Block 2 Positions 5mm		$0.10		 1 	 $0.10	
Mini Relay SPDT 5 Pins 12VDC 10A 120V Contact		$0.64		 4 	 $2.56	
Fuse Holder with Cover 5x20mm M205 PCB 15A		$0.16		 4	 $0.64	
Fuse Glass Time Delay 5A 5x20				$0.20		 4	 $0.80	
LED 3mm Red						$0.02		 4	 $0.08	
LED 3mm Yellow						$0.02		 1	 $0.02	
1K OHM 1/4W 5% Carbon Film Resistor			$0.01		10	 $0.10	
330 OHM 1/4W 5% Carbon Film Resistor			$0.01		10	 $0.10	
10K OHM 1/4W 5% Carbon Film Resistor			$0.01		10	 $0.10	
ULN2803A ULN2803 2803 TRANSISTOR ARRAY-8 NPN IC		$0.37		 1 	 $0.37	
18 pin DIP IC Socket Adaptor Solder Type		$0.06		 1	 $0.06	
14 pin DIP IC Socket Adaptor Solder Type		$0.05		 1	 $0.05	
0.1uF 50V Multilayer Ceramic Capacitor			$0.06		 1	 $0.06
PIC16F688 8 bit Microcontroller IC			$1.90		 1	 $1.90		
220uF 25V 105C Radial Electrolytic Capacitor 8x11mm	$0.03		 2	 $0.06	
Tact Switch 6*6mm 7mm Through Hole SPST-NO		$0.04		 5	 $0.20	
LM7805 L7805 7805 Voltage Regulator IC 5V 1.5A		$0.18		 1	 $0.18	
40 Pin 2.54 mm Single Row Female Pin Header 		$0.24		 1	 $0.24	
40 Pin 2.54 mm Single Row Pin Header Strip		$0.15		 1	 $0.15	
Housing Connector 2.54mm 3 Pins				$0.03		 1	 $0.03	
Wafer Connector 2.54mm 3 Pins				$0.03		 1	 $0.03	
Crimp Terminal Connector 2.54mm				$0.03		 3	 $0.09	
3.5mm Enclosed Socket					$0.22		 1	 $0.22	
Copper Clad Board PCB Single Side 6x6"			$1.12		 1	 $1.12	


Total							$9.86

Optional MP3 player module sourced from mdfly.com

SD Card MP3 Player Module RS232-TTL Model: MOL-AU5121	$9.95

If you follow this BOM you will have a few left over resistors Tayda requires you to buy resistors 10 at a time.

The 2 channel version uses most of the same parts just fewer of them. exceptions would be the PIC16F688 is replaced by PIC12F683 and the ULN2803 is replaced with 2 PN2222A NPN transistors and 2 1N4002 diodes.


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## hpropman

nice job on these thanks for sharing


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## tstraub

I have had enough interest in the 4 channel version of this board to move forward with at least a small run of production PCBs. I would like to get a feel for how many boards to order. So, please post any interest you have in this thread. I know its late in the year to start Halloween so please think of this as a for next year project. I can't promises delivery before Halloween. The etch files are still available for anyone needing to get one together real quick.

The board has changed slightly from the home etch version but functionally will be the same. Going to a two sided board has allowed me to add a headphone jack for the audio output rather than the 3 pin header. Max current has been increased to 10 amps on each channel. I have attached a .pdf file of the proposed board layout.

A huge thanks goes out to Mactayl for helping iron out the final board layout and to scubaspookf and the rest of the guys over at SOP for the high interest to make this happen.

View attachment 4CH_place_v.1.pdf

Tyler


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## niblique71

I'm definately interested in a few for next year. You did a great service to design this and then make it "Plug n Solder".


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## tstraub

OK guys it seems I am taking my own thread off topic from the Technological Terror forum. I have been asked to move interest for this board to the vendors area. Please refrain from stating interest in this thread and use it only for technical questions or information. I will open a new thread in the vendors area as soon as I have a better idea on prices. 

Tyler


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## Death Master

So cool, I have to make them, then interface them with my plc controller, so I can have stand alone and total show control. Thank you for this.


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## Offwhiteknight

So what exactly can you do with these? If they are plug and play, I might be interested in, but I'm not exactly sure how to use one... 
(Other than it makes things extra cool)


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## tstraub

Offwhiteknight said:


> So what exactly can you do with these? If they are plug and play, I might be interested in, but I'm not exactly sure how to use one...
> (Other than it makes things extra cool)


You can think of it like an adjustable timer. Lets say you had a prop that when triggered you wanted to light up, jump out, and squirt water. You would need to use the 4 channel version because you have 3 different things going on. You would connect the light to relay #1, connect the pneumatic solenoid valve to relay#2 and the washer pump to relay#3.

Press and release the record button to start recording the sequence of events. Press and hold button 1 to turn on the lights. Then press and hold button 2 to activate the pneumatic cylinder. After the cylinder extends you would use button 3 to turn on the washer pump and spray water. Then you release button 2 so the pneumatic cylinder returns and release button 1 to turn the lights back off. Finally press and release the record button again to stop recording.

After you have the sequence recorded you would connect your trigger(most likely a PIR motion sensor). Then every time it's triggered it will play back the sequence just like you recorded it.

The plug and play part means that you do not have to write code in a text editor program to set up all the timing intervals.


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## Death Master

Ok I ordered all the parts I need to build 2 of the 4 channel, MDFLY are out of the MP3 players MOL-AU5121 but I did find them on EBay for 12$, also taydeaelectronics are out of 1K resistors found some on EBay. Can’t wait to get my parts so I can try my hand at building this controller. I’m thinking on ways to modify and expand your circuit for LED lighting control, dimming and RGB with onboard power handling for the low voltage lighting. Oh yeah and an 25w amp for speakers.


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## tstraub

Death Master said:


> Ok I ordered all the parts I need to build 2 of the 4 channel, MDFLY are out of the MP3 players MOL-AU5121 but I did find them on EBay for 12$, also taydeaelectronics are out of 1K resistors found some on EBay. Can't wait to get my parts so I can try my hand at building this controller. I'm thinking on ways to modify and expand your circuit for LED lighting control, dimming and RGB with onboard power handling for the low voltage lighting. Oh yeah and an 25w amp for speakers.


You are going to run into several issues modifying this circuit for LED dimming control. First of all the relays are going to have to go. They simply are not designed to switch at the speed required to make an LED appear dim to the human eyes. Second dimming values are going to take a lot more storage space than is available in the EEPROM of the chip. The third problem is how are you going to input a dimmed value using simple momentary contact switches?

Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to discourage you from trying to design you own controller. I encourage anyone to try something new. If I were you I would look into using a design that already is setup to dim LEDs then try to add the MP3 module. This Cylon eye circuit has the ability to dim 8 channels of LEDs and uses the same PIC16F688 micro. It might be a good place to start.

Tyler


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## corey872

Seems like a neat device! Thanks for taking the time for build, document and share!

One question - the MP3 player plays an ambient track always, then switches to a second track when the circuit is triggered, then you say it switches back to ambient 'after a few minutes?'

Seems like you'd want to switch back to ambient immediately once the sequence is done?


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## tstraub

While the controller in in the not triggered state it does 3 things

1. It checks for a record signal from the record button if the record signal is received it starts the record loop. 

2. It checks the trigger and starts playback if a signal is recieved.

3. It checks the busy pin of the MP3 module and starts the ambient sound track if no MP3 is currently being played.

In the video the MP3 used as the scare track was longer than the animation sequence. The "few minutes" was the the time it took to finish playing the scare track. If a shorter length MP3 is used it will play the ambient track as soon as the controller goes to the not triggered state and no MP3 is currently being played. 

Tyler


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## Death Master

I just saw your little board as a great base to jump from to make a control board for my special needs. I knew I couldn’t get the LEDs to dim using the relays you have on that board, I was thinking about using a SSR to drive them and a pot to program the input values for dimming? Can I add an EEPROM for more storage? I have used the PICAX and have done some prop-1 programming before (flashing) but I have not tried PICKIT, nor have I done any real circuit design. Thank you for your input it is greatly appreciated.


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## silentskream

tstraub said:


> You can think of it like an adjustable timer. Lets say you had a prop that when triggered you wanted to light up, jump out, and squirt water. You would need to use the 4 channel version because you have 3 different things going on. You would connect the light to relay #1, connect the pneumatic solenoid valve to relay#2 and the washer pump to relay#3.
> 
> Press and release the record button to start recording the sequence of events. Press and hold button 1 to turn on the lights. Then press and hold button 2 to activate the pneumatic cylinder. After the cylinder extends you would use button 3 to turn on the washer pump and spray water. Then you release button 2 so the pneumatic cylinder returns and release button 1 to turn the lights back off. Finally press and release the record button again to stop recording.
> 
> After you have the sequence recorded you would connect your trigger(most likely a PIR motion sensor). Then every time it's triggered it will play back the sequence just like you recorded it.
> 
> The plug and play part means that you do not have to write code in a text editor program to set up all the timing intervals.


*mesmerized*

i'm going to have to learn how to make mechanical props so that i can play with this.


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## tstraub

Death Master said:


> I just saw your little board as a great base to jump from to make a control board for my special needs. I knew I couldn't get the LEDs to dim using the relays you have on that board, I was thinking about using a SSR to drive them and a pot to program the input values for dimming? Can I add an EEPROM for more storage? I have used the PICAX and have done some prop-1 programming before (flashing) but I have not tried PICKIT, nor have I done any real circuit design. Thank you for your input it is greatly appreciated.


Have you seen Steve's (Halstaff) button banger? His uses a PICaxe chip and an external EEPROM. If you have some PICaxe experience and the download cable it might be a good place to look for more info. My design borrowed a lot of the concepts from his board. I basically redesigned his with parts I had on hand and this it what I came up with. I look forward to hearing more about what you come up with. Sharing designs and modifying others designs is one of the best things about this type of project. Its amazing to me what people can come up with when everybody helps each other out.


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## tstraub

I have made some changes to the firmware on this controller. The new firmware adds an options menu to select longer record times and to enable a re trigger delay. You can now select up to four minute sequence length. The catch is at four minute record time the switch sample rate is nearly 500 ms. I don't think this is too big of a problem. If a prop takes 4 minutes to complete its action I think a half second timing error is acceptable.

The re-trigger delay is a sequence of 4 timers that can be enabled in any combination you want. the timers are 1 minute, 2 minute, 3 minute, and 4 minute timers. If you want a 10 minute delay between possible triggering events enable all 4 timers. if you need 7 minutes enable the 3 and 4 minute timers. the ambient audio track is played once before the delay and not restarted during the delay so if you are using an ambient audio track and a trigger delay the audio file must be at least as long as the delay time. Just use your favorite MP3 editing software to loop the audio enough times to extend the file length

I'm not sure how many of these have been built, maybe just the three I etched? Anyway the etch files have been downloaded enough times that I believe there might be a few out there in the wild. The updated firmware is too large for me to attach here so if you want a copy drop me a PM with your email address and I'll send it to you. Just flash the microchip and drag the 2 included MP3 files to the SD card. As always questions, comments, and criticisms are welcome.


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## Frighteners Entertainment

Neat little set up!


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## tstraub

I did a little more tweaking with the firmware today. The trigger delay times are now 1, 2, 4, and 8 minutes. The new values may be a bit more confusing because the intervals do not line up with the switch numbers like before. But it eliminates the overlap of sum values when enabling more than one timer. Now by enabling the correct timers you can choose up to 16 different timer values anything from 0 minutes all the way up to 15 minutes in 1 minute increments. 

Tyler


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## kauldron

I am looking to animate a FCG in a mausoleum a little further than normal. My goal is to have the FCG operating all of the time but I am thinking about having wiper motors open and close a set of doors at a timed interval. Once the doors open I want a pair of small AC fans to turn on and blow cooled fog being pumped in to the mausoleum out of the open doors. The doors would stay open for a bit to allow the fog to clear and the FCG to be visible then the doors close and the process repeats. Would your controller design operate the whole process?


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## tstraub

kauldron said:


> I am looking to animate a FCG in a mausoleum a little further than normal. My goal is to have the FCG operating all of the time but I am thinking about having wiper motors open and close a set of doors at a timed interval. Once the doors open I want a pair of small AC fans to turn on and blow cooled fog being pumped in to the mausoleum out of the open doors. The doors would stay open for a bit to allow the fog to clear and the FCG to be visible then the doors close and the process repeats. Would your controller design operate the whole process?


Timer is built in so that should not be a problem. Small AC fans should also be just fine. The tricky part is going to be opening and closing the doors. Getting the doors to open, stop, and then close using only a timer will be next to impossible. If the timing is not perfect or anything changes just a little your open and closed positions will change just a little each time the doors operate. By the end of the night they will likely be way off. You really need some sort of a limit switch on the doors so they always stay in sync. This controller dose not support more than 1 input. In short this may not be the best choice for your needs.

User Halstaff has a few PICaxe based controllers the "kitchen sink" and the "prop controller" I believe both of them support more than one input. It would mean a few external switches and a lot of programming on your end but I think the results would be better with that type of controller. Maybe ask him if one of his will work for his needs.

Edit:
On second thought if you are not opposed to using a npeumatic cylinder to open the doors this controller should do the trick. 
Tyler


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## Xpendable

I would *highly *recommend using pneumatic cylinders to open and close the doors. Actually I am doing this with the front door on the "house" facade in my display (using my Arduino-based MonsterShield controller).

If you really must use motors, then you need to deal with limit switches and logic circuits (or use a microcontroller). Limit switches would be used tell the logic circuit (or micocontrolle)r when to shut off the motor(s). Basically as the door closes, it hits a contact switch that signals the controller that it should stop the motor. Then when the door is opened, there needs to be another limit switch so that the microcontroller will know when to turn off the motor in the reverse direction. If you don't do this, then you will destroy your motor or possibly even your doors as everything drifts outside of calibration. By the way, you'll also need to use something like an H-Bridge so that you can control the motor in both directions. All of this is possible, but it is going to take a lot more work than you realize.

That's why I'd advocate for using pneumatics. There's no need for limit switches... The cylinder has a fixed length it can extend and retract, and it will never extend or retract beyond it's mechanical limit. It's relatively simple to control from most prop controllers. The speed of the door opening and closing can be adjusted easily by using regulators and mechnical speed controllers. Of course the con is the cost. You'll need 1 solenoid valve, 1 cylinder for each door (you can tee 2 cylinders to the same solenoid valve so they operate from the same solenoid at the same time), various fittings, regulator (you could skip the regulator if you are only running 1 prop off the compressor), and of course the prop controller.


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## kauldron

Thanks for the info guys, that will give me something to chew on for a while. If I even decide to go that far with it. It sure would look good though.


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## Death Master

Ok got all my parts for two boards, I’m going to build one original and proto another one with an audio amp and more power handling capability and more inputs.


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## halstaff

I ordered one of the boards from Tyler and just completed assembly. It was easy to build and works perfectly. He's added some nice features and for the price, you can't go wrong!


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## DirtyZ

I'm very new to diy electronics. I just got myself set up with a soldering station and plan on building a few projects boards to get my soldering skills to an adequate level. I would then love to build one of these, but I'm lost at the part where you have to "flash the micro controllers". Could someone enlighten me as to what tools are necessary to accomplish this, and what the process is? Thanks.


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## tstraub

DirtyZ said:


> I'm very new to diy electronics. I just got myself set up with a soldering station and plan on building a few projects boards to get my soldering skills to an adequate level. I would then love to build one of these, but I'm lost at the part where you have to "flash the micro controllers". Could someone enlighten me as to what tools are necessary to accomplish this, and what the process is? Thanks.


Flashing the PIC is pretty easy to do you will need a microchip PICkit 2 or PICkit 3 and the software that comes with your programmer. This PCB board does not have a programming header built in so the PIC needs to be installed into a ZIF socket adapter board. Basically you will plug the PICkit into the USB port on your computer and into the ZIF adapter then then run the software. Its not a whole lot more complicated than putting MP3 files on an MP3 player.

If you prefer you can also buy a flashed PIC from me when you order your PCB. Its against the rules for vendors to cross link threads so I can not provide a direct link for you but look for me in the vendors section if you would like more info on ordering a PCB and/or microchip.

Tyler


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## DirtyZ

Just ordered a board and flashed chip + all necessary components to complete! I am very excited to get this project under way! I put together a couple different project boards I bought at radio shack yesterday on clearance. I would say 98% of my joints came out very nicely on the first try so I am confident about putting together something worthwhile now. Not that the flashing LED heart I made for my wife wasn't worthwhile in the end. :biggrinkin:


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## tstraub

DirtyZ, if you got the Radio Shack kits assembled this one should not be any more difficult than those. Just a note of caution when it comes time to solder in the fuse holders do not install the fuse and cover until after you solder the base to the PCB. If you try to solder it all as one piece the heat will transfer from the holder to the fuse and this will cause the parts to take longer to come up to temperature. All that heat over an extended period of time can distort the plastic cover and it may not fit properly. So solder the base only then put the fuse in the cover and snap it into place.

Good luck and let me know if you have any questions. I will be working on documentation including a step by step build instruction to help people build this controller. The feedback I receive from you and the rest of the guys who are building will be a great help for me to make the build documents better. The more questions you guys ask the more I know what needs to be in the documents.

Tyler


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## gsaltz

I love this controller board. I have mine controlling my pneumatic valves.
Its really easy to put together. I even etched my own board from Tyler's plans (first time doing that).
Dirtyz, if you run into problems or what to know more about the PIC programming, let me know. I am just down the road in Omaha.
Gordon


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## David_AVD

Just an idea. Would it be useful to be able to record each channel one at a time? Think of it as like overdubs in the audio world.

That way you could build up the overall sequence in several passes, especially if the controller had more channels. Less buttons to press each time.

Maybe features like this could be in a more complex (and higher cost) controller? I do like the simplicity of this one of course.

Anyway, just my random thoughts for the day.


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## tstraub

David_AVD said:


> Just an idea. Would it be useful to be able to record each channel one at a time? Think of it as like overdubs in the audio world.
> 
> That way you could build up the overall sequence in several passes, especially if the controller had more channels. Less buttons to press each time.
> 
> Maybe features like this could be in a more complex (and higher cost) controller? I do like the simplicity of this one of course.
> 
> Anyway, just my random thoughts for the day.


That is an interesting idea. I don't think it is needed for this controller. 4 buttons is pretty easy single handed key banging. But, if you had enough channels to require both hands there would be a real advantage to an overdub feature.


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## David_AVD

Yeah, I was thinking that features like that would only be in a larger controller. Not sure if there's even a need for larger controllers in the Halloween context?

Anyway, just wanted to throw the thought out there. I can start a new thread if you think there's interest in a larger DIY controller.


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## DirtyZ

The last of my parts came in today so I was able to assemble my board. Won't have a chance to test it tonight, but I'm happy with the way everything came out on it.


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## tstraub

Looks Great Arron. I'm sure it will work great when testing and provide you with years of trouble free service.

Tyler


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## KeithTarpley

Greetings,,,

Just got the first one put together without issue. Works nicely.


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## tstraub

As more and more of the 4 channel controllers are built I have come realize that lack of proper documentation on my part is making it hard for some haunters to use this controller. I have updated the first post of this thread to include written instructions on how to use this controller. I hope this helps clear some things up.

Tyler


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## niblique71

tstraub said:


> oh, Sorry I forgot to post the BOM. I try to buy from taydaelectronics.com whenever possible. There part selection is not a good as mouser but the prices are great shipping is low cost and reasonably fast(usually about a week or so). here is a list of the parts I used on the 4 channel version of the board.
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> Parts sourced from Taydaelectronics.com
> 
> Product Name						Unit Price	Qty	Subtotal
> DG301 Screw Terminal Block 3 Positions 5mm		$0.15		 4	 $0.60
> DG301 Screw Terminal Block 2 Positions 5mm		$0.10		 1 	 $0.10
> Mini Relay SPDT 5 Pins 12VDC 10A 120V Contact		$0.64		 4 	 $2.56
> Fuse Holder with Cover 5x20mm M205 PCB 15A		$0.16		 4	 $0.64
> Fuse Glass Time Delay 5A 5x20				$0.20		 4	 $0.80
> LED 3mm Red						$0.02		 4	 $0.08
> LED 3mm Yellow						$0.02		 1	 $0.02
> 1K OHM 1/4W 5% Carbon Film Resistor			$0.01		10	 $0.10
> 330 OHM 1/4W 5% Carbon Film Resistor			$0.01		10	 $0.10
> 10K OHM 1/4W 5% Carbon Film Resistor			$0.01		10	 $0.10
> ULN2803A ULN2803 2803 TRANSISTOR ARRAY-8 NPN IC		$0.37		 1 	 $0.37
> 18 pin DIP IC Socket Adaptor Solder Type		$0.06		 1	 $0.06
> 14 pin DIP IC Socket Adaptor Solder Type		$0.05		 1	 $0.05
> 0.1uF 50V Multilayer Ceramic Capacitor			$0.06		 1	 $0.06
> PIC16F688 8 bit Microcontroller IC			$1.90		 1	 $1.90
> 220uF 25V 105C Radial Electrolytic Capacitor 8x11mm	$0.03		 2	 $0.06
> Tact Switch 6*6mm 7mm Through Hole SPST-NO		$0.04		 5	 $0.20
> LM7805 L7805 7805 Voltage Regulator IC 5V 1.5A		$0.18		 1	 $0.18
> 40 Pin 2.54 mm Single Row Female Pin Header 		$0.24		 1	 $0.24
> 40 Pin 2.54 mm Single Row Pin Header Strip		$0.15		 1	 $0.15
> Housing Connector 2.54mm 3 Pins				$0.03		 1	 $0.03
> Wafer Connector 2.54mm 3 Pins				$0.03		 1	 $0.03
> Crimp Terminal Connector 2.54mm				$0.03		 3	 $0.09
> 3.5mm Enclosed Socket					$0.22		 1	 $0.22
> Copper Clad Board PCB Single Side 6x6"			$1.12		 1	 $1.12
> 
> 
> Total							$9.86
> 
> Optional MP3 player module sourced from mdfly.com
> 
> SD Card MP3 Player Module RS232-TTL Model: MOL-AU5121	$9.95
> 
> If you follow this BOM you will have a few left over resistors Tayda requires you to buy resistors 10 at a time.
> 
> The 2 channel version uses most of the same parts just fewer of them. exceptions would be the PIC16F688 is replaced by PIC12F683 and the ULN2803 is replaced with 2 PN2222A NPN transistors and 2 1N4002 diodes.


This may be a really stupid question, but, Do we need that copper clad PCB 6" X 6" if we've already ordered the pre-etched boards from you?? I assume that board is for those that want to etch thier own? Besides thosre boards are a dollar more than listed and if it's unessary, I'll just omit them.

Got my order ready and want to hit the "Purchase Button"


----------



## DirtyZ

You do not need the PCB on that list. I went off of the list posted in his thread in the vendor area. If using that list, you need to add the 3.5mm jack as it was mistakenly omitted.


----------



## tstraub

As DirtyZ has indicated the BOM is a little different between the home etched and production PCB. Follow the one in the PCB thread and make sure you don't forget the audio jack. You can omit the PIC16F688 since you ordered them from me. You will have some extra resistors due to the fact that Tayda only sells them in packs of 10


----------



## niblique71

DirtyZ said:


> You do not need the PCB on that list. I went off of the list posted in his thread in the vendor area. If using that list, you need to add the 3.5mm jack as it was mistakenly omitted.





tstraub said:


> As DirtyZ has indicated the BOM is a little different between the home etched and production PCB. Follow the one in the PCB thread and make sure you don't forget the audio jack. You can omit the PIC16F688 since you ordered them from me. You will have some extra resistors due to the fact that Tayda only sells them in packs of 10


I quickly realized that I didn't need some items as I double checked the second thread. I did get the 3.5mm Audio jacks though. Thanks for everything and I'm looking foirward to assembly and testin

One question though. Is there anything special that I need to dso to use a PIR for triggering?? I've bought the ones from Radio shack before and managed (With help) to use them with my Picaboo. It needed a small circuit including a Voltage regulator and a transistor and possibly a few other items depending on the application to make it work properly..


----------



## tstraub

I checked Radio Shack's website and I see that they offer a few different types of PIR sensors. I am going to assume you are talking about the parallax brand PIR sensor that sells for $11.99. I have not used that specific PIR sensors so I can't say with absolute certainty that it will work. I did take a look at the datasheet and I believe that it will work just fine. The wiring would be as follows.



Code:


Controller Pin            PIR pin
   -                      GND
   +                      VCC
   SIG                    OUT

The PIR that I use is this one

Tyler


----------



## DirtyZ

I am using the Parallax brand PIR sensor from Radio Shack on a prop. It works fine wired as Tyler has suggested. Are you talking about the bare sensors they have? about the size of an LED with three leads coming off it? Those need a custom board to operate.


----------



## niblique71

I've used This PIR from Radio Shack . I believe that's the same one that DirtyZ has used. BUT.... the one TStraub linked to above is 1/3rd the cost. if I buy 4-5 of 'em it'll make up for shipping costs. I'm Looking forward to this project.


----------



## JeffHaas

The one TStraub linked to is very similar to the one at Radio Shack, I have both and you can use either one with the same code.


----------



## Death Master

Hay tstrayb there is a discrepancy in the parts list on this thread and on the vender thread for the boards, you are showing 2-220uf caps on this thread, and 2-470uf caps on the vender thread….So which one is the right part to use? I’m guessing 470uf because the silk screen on the board is showing the 470uf.


----------



## tstraub

The BOM in the vendors forum in the most up to date one. I have built this board with both 220uf and 470uf they both worked just fine in my experience. I spec'd the 220 early on because that's what I had on hand when I built the prototype. I later decided to change it to provide a little extra filtering and make it more tolerant to using unregulated wall warts as the power supply. 

You will find a few other changes as well if you look. Fuse size was also upgraded to 10 amp on the production boards due to the fact that the production boards have more copper mass on the output traces than the home etch version. And the audio output Jack has been changed from a 3 pin header to a headphone Jack. The headphone Jack was inadvertently left off of the BOM in the vendors thread but I made the correction in post #3.

Tyler


----------



## Death Master

Ok bought 2 PCBs and built both boards in about an hour, very easy. Those of you who don’t solder very much the best way I found to make it go quick is to do it in layers, small parts first then the larger, put them in their spots on the board, then tape them lightly down so you can flip the boards and get to soldering. And if you have one, use a PCB holder. I flashed the PIC's and popped them on the board. The boards work great. 

Thanks again Tyler!!


----------



## tstraub

Glad to hear you got them going in such a short amount of time. It will take a little longer for most people to build one. But, that feeling of accomplishment when you solder the whole thing then flash the micro and watch it come to life is something you just have to experience to understand.


----------



## djsiuk

*3.5mm Stereo Enclosed Socket Chassis Jack for PCB's*

Hi.

Please can anyone tell me, if this the correct 3.5mm Stereo Enclosed Socket Chassis from Tayda Electronics SKU A-853 for the bought PCB's.

http://www.taydaelectronics.com/3-5mm-stereo-enclosed-socket-chassis-jack.html

Thanks

Si


----------



## tstraub

Yep that's the one. You can find the complete BOM in the first post of the thread in the vendors area of the forum. Post #1 contains everything but that Jack post #3 is the amendment to add SKU A-853. As a vendor it is against the rules for me to provide a direct link to that thread but You can find it easy enough with a quick search.

Tyler


----------



## djsiuk

*Amendment*



tstraub said:


> Yep that's the one. You can find the complete BOM in the first post of the thread in the vendors area of the forum. Post #1 contains everything but that Jack post #3 is the amendment to add SKU A-853. As a vendor it is against the rules for me to provide a direct link to that thread but You can find it easy enough with a quick search.
> 
> Tyler


Hi Tyler.

Thanks.

Si


----------



## djsiuk

*K150 Pic Programmer*

Hi all.

£10 K150 USB Pic Programmer came and worked fine on Windows 7. Phew!

Pics programmed and verified with the controller HEX supplied.

Saved me a absolute fortune on a Real PICKit.

Si


----------



## GhoulishCop

Er, if the 14-pin and 18-pin connectors are oriented backwards on the boards, i.e., notching facing to the right instead of the left, will the controllers still work if we still orient the chips correctly to the connector? 

Or will I need to desolder the connectors from the boards and flip them around? Reading English is so hard.

Rich


----------



## tstraub

As long as you put the chips in correctly(with the pin#1 index mark to the left it will work fine. I wouldn't recommend trying to de-solder the socket. The risk of damaging the PCB is to great concerning it will work just fine as is. You could always put a dot of paint on the left side of the socket to make a new index mark to avoid confusion if you ever need to remove the ICs

Tyler


----------



## Death Master

Made 4 so far the only problem I have had was a PIC didn’t flash right, kept getting errors while flashing it. I didn’t have any issue with the others, so I ordered another PIC. LOVE this board Tyler!!! It’s a lot cheaper than any other I have used, I have used the Allen Bradley Pico and that thing is super expensive, Pico boo, EFX both kind of cost restrictive. This is perfect for a guy that likes to build…like me. Thanks again Tyler.


----------



## tstraub

Woody, What programer are you using PICkit 2, PICkit3, or something else? What error is it giving you? It's very rare that a PIC is bad right out of the box. I guess its possible you got a bad one given the fact that 3 of the 4 chips programed without error. Sometimes rebooting the PC can resolve programming issues. I have also had good luck powering the chip from an external source during programming on some chips that didn't want to cooperate when powered threw the PICkit.

Tyler

Tyler


----------



## Death Master

Tyler Im useing the PICkit 2, havent tried using a external power source yet, Ill try that before I toss the pic....Thanks for your help brother!


----------



## mroct31

Anyone have a suggestion for a housing for these? Will it fit in a store bought prop box or will I have to Macguyver something?


----------



## Death Master

mroct31 said:


> Anyone have a suggestion for a housing for these? Will it fit in a store bought prop box or will I have to Macguyver something?


I use both plastic and steel hoffmann boxes.


----------



## mroct31

What power supply should I use to power this? 12V 1000mah or ?


----------



## tstraub

mroct31 said:


> What power supply should I use to power this? 12V 1000mah or ?


12 volts DC 300mA or higher is plenty for the controller. If are planing use the same power supply on the output of the relays to drive 12 volt lights, motors, ect. you will have to calculate the total amps needed for the outputs then add about 300mA for the controller itself.

Tyler


----------



## halstaff

Tyler, I'm going to be leading this build at the Rocky Mountain Groups Annual Gathering and already have 25 kits spoken for.
Please set some aside for me and we can work out the payment.
Thanks.


----------



## tstraub

halstaff said:


> Tyler, I'm going to be leading this build at the Rocky Mountain Groups Annual Gathering and already have 25 kits spoken for.
> Please set some aside for me and we can work out the payment.
> Thanks.


Sounds great Steve I'll set aside out for you.


----------



## niblique71

I definately want two PCB's and two more flashed chips.. I just have to get to the bank to add some money to my paypal account I already have all of the electronic componants to build them including memory cards..Hopefully I can get this done by the end of the week. Been busy


----------



## djsiuk

*5th Channel to the board?*

Hi all.
I wanted to add a 5th channel always on/off whilst running controller programme to the brilliant board.









Please can anyone tell how I get the trigger (trigger out) for the duration of the controller programme? 
Can I use pin 14 from the PIC chip as a trigger out?

Thanks

Si ;-)


----------



## tstraub

Pin #14 is the VSS(power supply ground) if you connected your circuit to it the relay would never come on. There are no free I/O pins on the PIC. Its a 14 pin chip 2 pins are used to power the chip, 5 are used for the switches, 4 for the relays, 2 for serial communications with the MP3 module and 1 for the recording LED. It's simply full the only way to add an extra relay would be to loose something.


----------



## BobbyA

tstraub said:


> Pin #14 is the VSS(power supply ground) if you connected your circuit to it the relay would never come on. There are no free I/O pins on the PIC. Its a 14 pin chip 2 pins are used to power the chip, 5 are used for the switches, 4 for the relays, 2 for serial communications with the MP3 module and 1 for the recording LED. It's simply full the only way to add an extra relay would be to loose something.


I would have replied to his original question but you are probably more useful to have the discussion with (and his is black text on dark grey background is really hard to work with.).

Without knowing what he wants the 5th channel for, in theory he could add (or create using 4 diodes and a resistor) a 4 input OR gate and his diagrammed relay circuit ( he might need higher gain transistor to reduce pic loading, I haven't checked).

That would give him an output channel that is on whenever there is a any output on, he would need to check and make sure at least 1 other channel is on in his routine before the he turns each channel off.

Depends a lot on how he wants to use the 5th channel. 
Any thoughts on the suggestion ?


----------



## tstraub

BobbyA said:


> I would have replied to his original question but you are probably more useful to have the discussion with (and his is black text on dark grey background is really hard to work with.).
> 
> Without knowing what he wants the 5th channel for, in theory he could add (or create using 4 diodes and a resistor) a 4 input OR gate and his diagrammed relay circuit ( he might need higher gain transistor to reduce pic loading, I haven't checked).
> 
> That would give him an output channel that is on whenever there is a any output on, he would need to check and make sure at least 1 other channel is on in his routine before the he turns each channel off.
> 
> Depends a lot on how he wants to use the 5th channel.
> Any thoughts on the suggestion ?


The method you describe should work as long as one of the other 4 outputs is always on like you describe. one other option would be to remove the Recording LED and use it as the trigger for the 5th channel. This would require changes to the firmware but in theory it should be doable.


----------



## usafcharger

Just checked MDFLY and they now have the sound boards in stock again.


----------



## Rev Noch

I built a couple of these units over the weekend, and so far, they're damn impressive. I neglected to order the audio jack to solder to the board so I haven't gotten to test that functionality yet.

I do have one question about the microchip and programming this. I have practically zero experience with this type and I'm still waiting on my Pic Kit to arrive. I'm likely going to build a couple of identical props and would want the routine to be the same on them both. If I were to program one of the controllers, take out the microchip, download the code from that chip; then import that code to another chip, would the clone of the original remember the recordings as well?

If not, is there a way that you can think of to duplicate routines?


----------



## tstraub

Rev Noch said:


> I built a couple of these units over the weekend, and so far, they're damn impressive. I neglected to order the audio jack to solder to the board so I haven't gotten to test that functionality yet.


Sorry about that I have tried to get the BOM edited but since the post is in the vendors section I do not have the permissions to edit post #1 
edit: the BOM has been updated. This should help everyone in the future 


Rev Noch said:


> I do have one question about the microchip and programming this. I have practically zero experience with this type and I'm still waiting on my Pic Kit to arrive. I'm likely going to build a couple of identical props and would want the routine to be the same on them both. If I were to program one of the controllers, take out the microchip, download the code from that chip; then import that code to another chip, would the clone of the original remember the recordings as well?
> 
> If not, is there a way that you can think of to duplicate routines?


All of the sequence information is stored in The EEPROM section of the PIC16F688 so as long as you have the EEPROM data enabled in your Pickit software the sequence will be copied as well. Attached is a picture of the check box you need to have checked. The picture shows the PICkit3 scripting tool but the Pickit2 standalone software looks almost identical. You could also do this with MPLAB software but MPLAB is a bit more cumbersome to get used to. The standalone software is really easy to work. Just put the old chip in your ZIF socket click Read. Swap in the new chip and click Write and your done.


----------



## Rev Noch

tstraub said:


> Sorry about that I have tried to get the BOM edited but since the post is in the vendors section I do not have the permissions to edit post #1
> edit: the BOM has been updated. This should help everyone in the future


No worries, I knew that I had to add that to the cart and it wasn't in the list, but I had a brain fart.

Thanks for the info on saving the routines and making this kit in general. It looks like I'll be getting my PicKit today so I'll be able to test it all out here shortly.


----------



## Jack Is Back

I assembled 2 of these boards over the weekend and it went great. Well except for when I attached the first board's power terminals. Soldered them on backwards because sometimes I'm just a D&$%a$$.

Everything worked beautifully and now I have 2 new 4 relay programmable prop controllers. Thanks Tyler!


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## tstraub

I'm glad to hear you got them together. Soldering parts in backwards happens to everybody from time to time. I find that I learn more from the mistakes I make than the ones that go right the first time. Just wait for the smoke to clear and give it another go


----------



## DarkSilver

I have a question on the mdfly sound board. does the board play the the entire file when triggered or does the play only last as long as the trigger is applied?
I have purchased a few "HC-SR501 IR Pyroelectric Infrared IR PIR Motion Sensor Detector Module" and had the thought to make a motion activated sound devices, that play a background sound like crickets till activated. the let out a surprise (scream ,howl,raven ect...)?


----------



## JeffHaas

The Tenda board that MDFly sells is designed to take commands from a microprocessor (Arduino, Picaxe, etc.) and then play the files on its own. You send it a command that's the equivalent of "Play MP3 #1" and it plays it. It will keep playing the file until you tell it to stop.

You have to use it with a microprocessor, which will control it.


----------



## tstraub

The mdfly MP3 player is not directly controlled by the PIR motion sensor. The MP3 player needs a serial communication signal to activate. This controller handles the MP3 function in the following way.

While the controller is in the not triggered state it continually checks the busy pin of the mdfly module to see if an MP3 file is currently being played. If nothing is being played it tells the mdfly board to starts track 001(the ambient sound track). This insures so that the ambient sound will keep playing in a loop as long as the controller does not receive a signal from the PIR.

As soon as the controller receives a signal from the PIR it tells the mdfly board to stop playing the current track and start playing MP3 file 002(the scare track). Then the controller plays the sequence of button presses you recorded earlier. When its finished playing the recorded sequence it stops the MP3 player ang goes back to the not triggered state. From the not triggered state the controller sees that no MP3 is being played so it starts track 001 again.


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## DarkSilver

is the mdfly board the same as the Tenda TDB380 board? I found specs on that one.


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## JeffHaas

That's the one. MDFly is one place that sells it.


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## nutshy

I would like to purchase 4 of the 4 channel boards with the PICs diy


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## tstraub

I am out of stock on the PICs right now but have some on order. I will send you a pm when they are ready to ship


----------



## typoagain

Jack Is Back said:


> I assembled 2 of these boards over the weekend and it went great. Well except for when I attached the first board's power terminals. Soldered them on backwards because sometimes I'm just a D&$%a$$.


 
Jack, are we related? LOL!

I built a Ramsey Electronics FM30B FM transmitter and managed to put in a chip backwards. Naturally it was a chip that had, like, 18 solder points. I screwed up the board so bad that I ended up sending it to Ramsey in NY to get it fixed. Luckily, they only charged me $25 dollars to fix it, including shipping! That was a lot cheaper than buying another $200 kit.


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## Hippofeet

someone needs to invent a better solder-sucker. Ill chip in to their kickstarter.


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## LAKE OF THE DEAD

tstraub,will you pm me when you get them in ,thank you


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## MikeBru

tstraub, this ROCKS!!
I'd be interested in a few of these boards. The videos pretty much answered my questions but i do have some. Can i use my beam sensors instead of a PIR? (example of what I mean http://www.frightprops.com/controlle...am-sensor.html) If I wire my sensor to a servo plug then I could just plug that in instead of a PIR, correct? How do I upload sound to the MP3? What I would order is the board as you have it, the MP3 upgrade, but not the PIR or the power supply. What is your price for that configuration? Oh, nearly forgot, the link mentioned on the first post doesn't seem to be there any more. How do I order from you and pay you? Thanks a lot! Mike


----------



## tstraub

Hello Mike Thanks for your interest. I do not sell assembled controllers just bare circuit boards and flashed PICs. Then you can order the rest of the parts and solder it all together yourself. The forum rules prevent me from answering sales questions in this thread for ordering information look in the vendors section or shoot me a PM. 

The link to the beam sensor you provided comes up as a 404 error. If the sensor you have outputs 5 volts or has a simple relay output it should work.

Tyler


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## scubaspook

The beam sensor will work as it is operating a relay. Use the black and white wires from the relay output of the beam sensor and connect them to the plus and signal side of the controller. I responded to your pm that you sent me from somewhere.


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## tstraub

Scuba is correct. Thanks for jumping in with the answer.


----------



## MikeBru

My boards and chips came in the mail! Thanks!! Takes me back to my childhood, building TVs and radios with my dad. Just looking at a blank circuit board is really fascinating and I'm looking forward to cackling like Adam Savage when the boards first fire off a prop. Now to just await the components to arrive. Yeah!!


----------



## MikeBru

hey Tstraub,
I received everything and assembled my boards. Tested them with the program already loaded and... I love 'em!!! Next I need to put the audio on my SD cards. this is soooo cool! Thank you so much for doing this for all in the Halloween community!


----------



## Doc-Dead-Inside

*I guess I goofed something...*

Thank you again Tyler!!I received my parts in the mail today, and jumped on getting it put together.

The only trouble I had was soldering the 3 pin header... It didn't seem to want to cooperate (I blame my soldering iron)... but now, after plugging it in and getting the audio squared away, I notice I'm not getting any juice to the 4th channel (switch), no led, no "click". and I'm not able to set the timing right off the bat. Everything else seems to be working fine though.... Any suggestions??

Luckily, I have three more boards, and a boat load of parts, I hope I have better luck with round 2.


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## tstraub

The #4 button is used to play back recorded sequences as well as run relay #4 during the recording process. Does your's play back the sequence is you press the #4 button while the ambient sound track is playing? I'm just trying to narrow the problem down to see if we need to diagnose a switch issue or a relay issue

If the playback function does work check the solder joints on pin#10 of the PIC16f688 chip, pins 9 and 11 of the ULN2803 chip and, relay#4 

If the playback function does not work check the solder joints at switch #4, the two resistors above switch #4, and Pin#7 of the 16F688 chip.


----------



## Doc-Dead-Inside

*@nd board awesome!!*

The second board (built today) works awesome! Everything is doing exactly what you said it would. Cant wait to hook up my solenoids and see how it all comes together.

As for the first board, I cant get it to even start a sequence. I was a little bit bummed out because I thought I did a pretty decent job, even though it was my first soldering project.

I will double check my soldering job when I get home, to see if I missed anything. I will say, the only place that had me worried is the etching on the backside of the board where the 3 pin trigger links to the 10k resistor, looks like the etching was a little bit "peeled" up, and almost separated from one of the hole that the 3 pin went through. I hope that made sense... If so, Would that cause a problem?


----------



## halstaff

Sounds like you overheated that connection and lifted the trace. Can you take a picture of the bottom of the board and post it?


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## tstraub

First of all congratulations on getting the second one working.

I agree with Steve sounds like you lifted a trace. Try to get a good in focus picture of the solder side of the PCB so we can see what we're dealing with and figure out the best way to repair the damage. It can be difficult to take a good picture of a circuit board. I always have the best luck with the macro setting, no flash and lots of ambient light. I see your post count is still very low here. I think you need to have 10 posts before you can attach pictures so if the forum will not let you attach a picture head over to the Welcome room and greet some of the other members or play some of the games in the fun and games forum to get that post count up. 

Also do you have a digital volt ohm meter? If you do it might help as we diagnose and repair this controller.


----------



## Doc-Dead-Inside

Thanks!

I appreciate you guys working with me on the problem. I will get on this weekend and get some more posts on here. I guarantee I over heated the first one, after looking at it. I have a pretty good pic of the spot I'm talking about. I will have it up for you guys soon. I only have a multi-meter, but if I'm not mistaken it has an ohms setting as well.

When I send this pic, don't make too much fun of my soldering job lol, like I said this was a first attempt.


----------



## Doc-Dead-Inside

The multi-meter is not digital, however my brother-in-law might have one, so I'll check.

Thanks again!


----------



## Doc-Dead-Inside

Was a false alarm. Apparently I had, what my brother-in-law referred to as, a "cold joint" at button #4.... And that was why nothing happened when I pushed it. So now I have 4 boards that are working awesome. I'll post pics or video of the completed project, soon as I fine tune a few things.


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## tstraub

Glad to hear you got it working. I am looking forward to seeing pics or video of you props.


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## Jaxon

Just finished building three of these awesome boards! I haven't hooked them up to anything yet but I am sure they will suit my needs just fine. Thank you for sharing!


----------



## grismcdonald

Tyler
I have read the whole post and it seems I am the only one have this issue. Maybe I am missing some instructions but I powered up the first board and it started in test mode. Ran thru the four relays. Now when powered up, plays the instruction mp3. I try to select the sequencing length but 1 or 2 only will adjust volume when pressed. Tried the second board with the same results. Can not get to program mode and always starts with 003.mp3. Any suggestions?

Thanks Gris


----------



## scubaspook

Make sure you do not have the PIR hooked up. Then hold down button 3 setup until the yellow light comes on. Then push button #1 once then push the record button. This will put he board on a 1 minute track with no delays. Then hit the record button and push the push button 1234. relays 123and 4 should come on as you are pushing the buttons. then push tyhe record button again. Now push the test button and see if the relays fire off as you programed them.


----------



## grismcdonald

Thanks Scubaspook. I will test it tomorrow and post reply. Should it start up in the instruct ion mode or will it not do this once I set it up?


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## scubaspook

When first powered up it should run its routine. Here is a vid on how to load the sd card files in case you have issues of it not playing the right track.


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## tstraub

If it's adjusting the volume when you are pressing buttons 1 and 2 then it is in the not in the setup mode. It is in the not triggered state. The controller is most likely working fine. The Tenda is grabbing the wrong MP3 file and playing the setup file when it should be playing the ambient track. I bet if you follow the instructions on the video scuba posted will get it working like it should.


----------



## grismcdonald

Thanks for the help. I'll post stupid. Went back to SD card and I guess I did not format it properly. Might have done quick format on PC. On Mac the only files that showed up were the 001-004 in order. Went back to PC and had some other files still there. Did a full FAT format and reloaded files. Wow, works like a charm. Scubaspook thanks for the response. I guess from my experience, which I told my son as he tore something apart, start with the basics, power to the device before you take it apart. I should have made sure the format swiped the SD card clean. I am sure I will have a few programming questions before it is over.

Thanks Gris


----------



## Death Master

Ok I had an issue this Halloween with my controller misfiring on me, it seemed to go off when any of my other props went off, also when I touched any bare metal on the prop, any suggestions? should I put a filtering cap across the input of the board? Im using a diffuse infrared industrial sensor.


----------



## tstraub

Woody, Have you tried to isolate the problem to either the controller or the trigger device? Do you have any more info on that sensor? Is the trigger somehow connected to the metal chassis of your prop? The prop firing when you touch the chassis does sound very odd because the control circuitry is isolated from the outputs so I'm not real sure where the electrical path would be between the prop and the trigger.

Firing when other props fire might be an indication of electrical noise on the trigger wiring. Are you by chance running the trigger wiring harness next to mains power? If so can the be easily moved further apart? 

You could try a filter cap if you have one handy but I don't know that it will help the PCB has a fairly large filter cap on it already. Are you capable of flashing the 16F688 chip? I could try to desensitize the trigger pin in the firmware and email you a .hex file and see if that clears up the issues. 

Tyler


----------



## discozombie

Here is the prop I made using Tyler's controller as the brains. Thanks Tyler for making a great DIY controller.
DZ
Video of Prop 



Prop Controller inside Tupperware container. 








With Tupperware lid on


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## niblique71

Wow, I just love These little wonders, So versatile and so effective with the sound card and delayed retrigger. BUT With 800 TOT's passing through En Mas, I'd like to reduce the retrigger time to perhaps as short as 15 seconds. How difficult is it to reprogram that line of code to set the retrigger for a value of less than one minute??? I already have a breadboard, BUT I don't have that $20 USB cable yet. 

at least 75% of my TOT's missed that one prop due to the 1 minute delay.


Other than that, These things are AMAZING!!! Great work and THANK YOU


----------



## discozombie

I think you can have it trigger again in like 10 seconds, I have mine doing that.


----------



## tstraub

niblique71 said:


> Wow, I just love These little wonders, So versatile and so effective with the sound card and delayed retrigger. BUT With 800 TOT's passing through En Mas, I'd like to reduce the retrigger time to perhaps as short as 15 seconds. How difficult is it to reprogram that line of code to set the retrigger for a value of less than one minute??? I already have a breadboard, BUT I don't have that $20 USB cable yet.
> 
> at least 75% of my TOT's missed that one prop due to the 1 minute delay.
> 
> Other than that, These things are AMAZING!!! Great work and THANK YOU


Changing the delay times is not difficult at all. Open the .gcb file with Great Cow Graphical BASIC and look for the following lines of code near the end of the playback subroutine 


Code:


	If Setup_info.0 on Then
		wait 1 m
	End If
	If Setup_info.1 on Then
		wait 2 m
	End If
	If Setup_info.2 on Then
		wait 4 m
	End If
	If Setup_info.3 on Then
		wait 8 m
	End If

the 1 m , 2 m, 4 m, and 8 m numbers designate time in minutes. You can change them to 15 s, 30 s, 1 m ,and 2 m if you want 15 sec 30 sec 1 min and 2 min. or whatever values you chose. Then recompile the hex file by clicking the compile button in the tools drop down list. Flash the 16f688 chip with the new hex and your good to go.

You might also want to make a new MP3 file for the .004 MP3 track so that the audio cues match the new delay times.


----------



## Jack Is Back

I've had no problems so far but I would like the ability to change the delay times to less than a minute in some situations. Not this year but in the past I've had people walk past props on delays and totally miss them.

What minimum hardware/software would I need to acquire in order to flash the chips?


----------



## tstraub

Jack Is Back said:


> I've had no problems so far but I would like the ability to change the delay times to less than a minute in some situations. Not this year but in the past I've had people walk past props on delays and totally miss them.
> 
> What minimum hardware/software would I need to acquire in order to flash the chips?


Hardware:
You will need a microchip PICKit 2, PICkit 3, or a suitable clone and a ZIF socket to put the chip into during the flashing procedure. I personally have a PICkit 2 clone and a real PICKit 3 both of them work fine. The microchip version feels more sturdy and well built. but the clone I have is 4 years old and has been well used and never given me any trouble.

here is a link for the clone I use http://www.ebay.com/itm/iCA03-USB-Microchip-PIC-dsPIC-EEPROM-ICSP-Zif-Socket-Programmer-Set-PICkit2-SW-/390691662598?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5af709ab06

and here is a link for a Microchip brand PICkit 3 http://www.ebay.com/itm/ICSP-Adapte...961?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ced73f891
Software
You will need Great Cow Graphical BASIC software. It free and can be downloaded here http://gcbasic.sourceforge.net/

You will also need the software for whichever programmer you get. Its also free and will come via download link or on a disc with your programmer

Tyler


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## chrisc

good job!...looks good.


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## Death Master

tstraub said:


> Woody, Have you tried to isolate the problem to either the controller or the trigger device? Do you have any more info on that sensor? Is the trigger somehow connected to the metal chassis of your prop? The prop firing when you touch the chassis does sound very odd because the control circuitry is isolated from the outputs so I'm not real sure where the electrical path would be between the prop and the trigger.
> 
> Firing when other props fire might be an indication of electrical noise on the trigger wiring. Are you by chance running the trigger wiring harness next to mains power? If so can the be easily moved further apart?
> 
> You could try a filter cap if you have one handy but I don't know that it will help the PCB has a fairly large filter cap on it already. Are you capable of flashing the 16F688 chip? I could try to desensitize the trigger pin in the firmware and email you a .hex file and see if that clears up the issues.
> 
> Tyler


I have isolated it to the controller, the type of cable I use for the sensor is double twisted pair shielded. I used metal stand offs to mount the board to a metal panel in a SS box so Im going to try and use plastic standoffs and see if that helps with the misfire on touch issue. Yes I am capable of flashing the 16F688, I have the cable and software. So please when you can and have the time email me the .hex files.


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## tstraub

I'll see what I can do in the firmware to help this issue. I'll send you an updated hex file in a few days.


----------



## Rooey

*Re: Updated firmware*



tstraub said:


> I'll see what I can do in the firmware to help this issue. I'll send you an updated hex file in a few days.


I wouldn't mind getting the updated firmware also, if you come up with a solution. I had some misfires with my controller as well. Other than that, man are these GREAT!! I am able to flash the PIC myself. Thanks Tyler!!


----------



## grismcdonald

Don't think there is an easy way for this but what if there was a fifth relay that was a constant when tiggered or a jumper to have one of the channels active during the duration of the sequence.


----------



## tstraub

Rooey said:


> I wouldn't mind getting the updated firmware also, if you come up with a solution. I had some misfires with my controller as well. Other than that, man are these GREAT!! I am able to flash the PIC myself. Thanks Tyler!!


I'm not sure how much time Woody has had to test the updated hex file but you're welcome to try it out and see if it clears things up for you. I'm at my attachment limit here on the forums so shoot me a PM with your email and I'll send a copy over to you.



grismcdonald said:


> Don't think there is an easy way for this but what if there was a fifth relay that was a constant when tiggered or a jumper to have one of the channels active during the duration of the sequence.


All of the I/O pins on the micro are in use so it would take major hardware changes to get an extra relay output. In theory you could trigger a 5th channel off the audio track if you were willing to have mono sound output. You could put your audio on one channel and a tone on the other. Then feed the audio out to your amplified speaker and the tone to a simple color organ circuit.


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## dommyboy

Has anybody else had issues with the mp3 playback module? I have now had 2 completely burn up on me...in 2 different controllers. I applied power to the controller earlier today; almost immediately it popped the gfci plug and I smelled burning. The part LM317 on the board was blazing hot. The other one that fried won't playback any music...no matter which card I put in. Oddly enough the led's still light up on that one and it is "trying"!

Any advice? Or are these boards to be considered cheap and disposable?


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## tstraub

What are you using for a power supply? The MP3 module is connected directly to the 12 volt DC input for the controller. The MP3 boards will not tolerate over voltage, reverse voltage, or AC voltage. The next version of the controller will have reverse voltage protection diodes on the input to help with these "oh sh#@" moments but with your current board what's done is done. Double check the input voltage and if the rest of the controller still seems to operate OK the replace the MP3 module and chalk it up to lessons learned. If your still having trouble with the controller itself I'll be happy to help get it figgured out


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## dommyboy

I've been using 12V power supplies, 1000 mA. I've had no real issues until now. My first mp3 board died almost instantaneously on power up, I think it was a DOA shipment, the second worked in several boards for both halloween props and for 3 hours a night everyday in December flawlessly. The controllers have been working flawlessly with and without the mp3 boards...pretty much doing whatever I've asked them to do. I am starting to question the mp3 board build quality (or the voltage regulator onboard the mp3 player); maybe I received a bad batch? I've got 3 more on order and will report back any findings hopefully later this week.


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## scubaspook

Out of over 100 mp3 modules that I have gone thru I have had out of the box maybe 2 that were bad. I have even fried one because I had hooked up the power backwards and another do to a bad solder job on the board. Other than that, the modules seem to work fairly well. When you get in another mp3 module try and look over the board for bad solder possibly or maybe something fell into the controller like when snipping the leads off of resistors and such. Just my thoughts and still putting the controllers thru their paces.


----------



## halstaff

Have you checked your power supply with a meter to make sure it's a regulated 12V DC? I've tested unregulated power supplies and gotten over 19V on a supply marked at 12V.
I also have used over 100 of these boards and only had 2 failures. Both were replaced with no questions asked by MdFly.


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## dommyboy

Well friends, I'm chalking this one up to 1 board DOA and 1 board failure from wear and tear (since they both failed in different ways). The controllers are working fine, and all of them controlled the good mp3 player just fine prior to yesterday (I had moved the module around a bunch, while the units had no power to them of course). They all still try and control one of my bad boards too (it still lights up and you can see when the trigger is activated, it just has no sound output. I've tried several SD cards on this one, somehow the audio out is bad and its been that way out of the box). I ran a multimeter across the board in both a dormant and an active triggering state, and the voltage did not budge off of 12V. I've also cleaned and inspected all leads and solders, it all looks good. I think I just may have worn one of these babies out! If I find anything else I'll keep you posted, but I suspect when these new modules come in they will work just fine!


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## dommyboy

The results are in...I may have received a bad batch of mp3 players from mdfly about 4 months ago. The only other theory I've entertained is that the controller may have been in a triggered state when powering up, but I don't know if that would fry a board. I received 3 brand new ones today and all of them test out just fine. Absolutely no issues; I tested them in the same controllers where one of my previous mp3 players completely fried. Hopefully I didn't stress anybody out with this "potential" issue!


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## tstraub

I ordered a few prototype PCBs for the next incarnation of the 4 channel controller board. The PCBs arrived here today and I built one. Here a picture for your enjoyment 
IMG_20140114_041741_zpsbe7f5745.jpg Photo by straubtyler | Photobucket

New features include reverse voltage protection on the input. The old version could be damaged if you hooked it up backwards this new one has a diode network that will allow the voltage to be connected either way and the controller keeps working.

I also added an RJ-45 jack and an optional wired remote control that can be used to record your sequence, adjust the volume, change things in the setup menu. This should be helpful for the guys that like to hide the controller deep inside their props and can't reach the button. It will also help you stand back from the prop out of danger of any moving props.

Anyway first test all look good here I'll send a PCB set to Tim (scubaspook) for additional testing and when we are both happy with this new design we will discus another PCB order.

Any technical questions or comments are welcome. Please note that this post is in the technical thread so I will not answer any price or ordering questions here. all of that info will come after testing is complete and I make a post in the vendors area.

Tyler


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## grismcdonald

Like the remote idea. Got the soldering iron hot. Test away.


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## hpropman

Nice job on the upgrades! How is Elecrow to deal with? I have been looking for a good reasonable board house to deal with.


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## tstraub

This order took just over a month from payment to delivery but that was the fault of hong kong post/USPS and the holiday time. It took 3 weeks between Hong Kong post reporting they gave it to USPS and USPS reporting they received it. Elecrow had the boards done and in the mail within a week from payment. I have dealt with Elecrow via email and their instant chat from the website. They always respond quickly and their English is good. I use and would recommend them for small runs of PCBs. My only suggestion is that if you are in any kind of a rush you pay the extra money and have them shipped via DHL.

Tyler


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## hpropman

Cool thanks for the info


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## grismcdonald

Any updates ?


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## scubaspook

Here is a link of the prototype in action. Tyler made a change or two after this vid was taken. China is having its New Year so there is a delay in getting the boards produced.


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## Jack Is Back

This board just keeps getting better and better. I love the extension control panel and the inclusion of the new diodes to prevent user error is a must have option.

Of course now I'm really sad since I've built 6 of them already with the old style boards. Now I want the new version. 

Keep up the good work!


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## scubaspook

It doesn't hurt to have to have 7 and by building another would keep your soldering skills sharp.  I can't wait to add these to my haunt this year.


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## robp790

I cannot wait to be able to buy 3 or 4 boards this year. I need one for my new Monster in a Box prop I will build this summer.


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## niblique71

I am a big fan of these boards. I have two more of the old ones ready to be built, but I'll probably wait till this new board is ready for distribution, and then get enough parts to finish a total of 4 new of the new version since the parts list will be very similar. 
I can't thank you guys enough for all of the fantastic work you have done for the haunt community. 

Also remember our conversation about getting a retrigger setting on your new chips to have 15 second 30 second , and 1 minute delay's built in to the chip. I believe most people will want something in those ranges rather than the longer delays originally designed in.

I'm too busy these days to learn the programming language although I would LOVE to give it a whirl if I had the time.


----------



## grismcdonald

There was talk about a 2 channel no sound controller. Not sure if that is still a consideration but if it is, I was wondering what the cost difference between the two would be, minus the sound card.


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## scubaspook

The cost difference isn't much. If you did away with the mp3 and sd card that would save about $20 of the cost if you don't want the sound. If you only want 2 channels then don't install 2 relays and associated parts but that is only knocking off maybe $2-$4.


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## scubaspook

niblique71 said:


> I am a big fan of these boards. I have two more of the old ones ready to be built, but I'll probably wait till this new board is ready for distribution, and then get enough parts to finish a total of 4 new of the new version since the parts list will be very similar.
> I can't thank you guys enough for all of the fantastic work you have done for the haunt community.
> 
> Also remember our conversation about getting a retrigger setting on your new chips to have 15 second 30 second , and 1 minute delay's built in to the chip. I believe most people will want something in those ranges rather than the longer delays originally designed in.
> 
> I'm too busy these days to learn the programming language although I would LOVE to give it a whirl if I had the time.


 Are you wanting a on delay (board is triggered but doesn't activate the relay until x amount of time goes by) or off delay (after the propo is activated wait x amount of time before it is retriggable)?


----------



## tstraub

Sorry for the delay real life has been crazy here. Today is the first time I logged in here in several days. I'm happy to see all the good comments posted in the last few days and Glad to see Tim has been answering questions.

As for PCB availability All I can say is we're working on it but its a busy time of year so delays are expected. I do have a very limited number of spares left over from this prototype run. I suppose I could sell those to recoup the prototyping cost. If you're interested shoot me a PM and we'll work out the details.

As far as shorter re trigger delays I could make the firmware changes if you have the tools to flash the chip.

I really haven't given the 2 channel board much thought lately. The biggest hangup I had before was that I thought their was not much interest in it and I don't want to be stuck with a bunch of PCBs that will not sell. Profit margins are fairly slim so when an order is placed we need to be reasonably sure that the boards will sell quickly and not tie up cash that would be be better spent on faster selling PCBs. I guess that what I'm saying is that I'm not sure that competing with myself is a good business decision. I'll give it some more thought and talk to Tim about it maybe the demand is there now. 

Tyler


----------



## niblique71

scubaspook said:


> Are you wanting a on delay (board is triggered but doesn't activate the relay until x amount of time goes by) or off delay (after the propo is activated wait x amount of time before it is retriggable)?


LOL, Duh, My apologies. I meant "off delay". I don't want my props to constantly retrigger during the busiest times, BUT 1 minute of delay before a retrigger is far too long for a busy haunt. It means that more people will miss a prop than see it in action.

Since 1 minute is the current shortest option, I think that 15 second, 30 second, 1 minute and 2 minutes could be a more popular range for haunters to select from. Of course I know we can customize the software but I'd prefer not to LOL.

Thanks again


----------



## Jack Is Back

*Success and another question!!!*

So I acquired a PicKit3, GCB and the software to flash my own chips. I successfully flashed a "blank" chip with the current firmware and verified it's all working on the controller. Hooray!!! 

Now my next question:

Is there anyway to hookup the PicKit3 to the chip directly on the board?

I obviously can pull the chip and flash and reinsert but eventually I'm going to smash the pins or something worse. I know I can do this with my Picaxe boards via the download circuit. If I can connect the same pins to the PicKit3 while it's mounted on the controller board I would hope I could flash it in place.

If it is possible a future mod for pins mounted on the controller itself would be nice. At least for people like myself who like to customize the code. :googly:


----------



## dommyboy

Hello all, it seems that 12V supplies are the common trend for these boards. Has anybody tried a 15V supply? I just happen to have a spare lying around and was wondering if it can be morphed for to use on one of these. Thanks!


----------



## scubaspook

I am sure it will be fine as long as it is DC. The voltage regulator should knock down the voltage for the chip and the mp3 player can handle more than 15 volts. I have never tried it as I like to use what has proven to work.


----------



## dommyboy

scubaspook said:


> I am sure it will be fine as long as it is DC. The voltage regulator should knock down the voltage for the chip and the mp3 player can handle more than 15 volts. I have never tried it as I like to use what has proven to work.


I was thinking the same thing. It didn't seem like a big enough jump to cause major issues. I'll let you know how it works out!

-the things you try when you are throwing out old equipment and want to recycle dc power adapters!


----------



## tstraub

Dom, sorry for the late reply. Real life has been busy and I have not logged in here for a few weeks. As Tim stated the 15 volts should be close enough just be careful about the voltage marked on the transformer compared to the real output. If it is a 15 volt unregulated transformer it might really be putting out close to 20 volts and that might be too much. 

If my memory is correct you ordered some of the first generation PCBs without the remote and added diode protection. then you later picked up some of the new design ones. If you have the option I would use one of the new boards with that transformer because the input diodes will knock off about 1.4 volts from the input voltage so it should be more tolerant to the higher voltage.


----------



## dommyboy

tstraub said:


> Dom, sorry for the late reply. Real life has been busy and I have not logged in here for a few weeks. As Tim stated the 15 volts should be close enough just be careful about the voltage marked on the transformer compared to the real output. If it is a 15 volt unregulated transformer it might really be putting out close to 20 volts and that might be too much.
> 
> If my memory is correct you ordered some of the first generation PCBs without the remote and added diode protection. then you later picked up some of the new design ones. If you have the option I would use one of the new boards with that transformer because the input diodes will knock off about 1.4 volts from the input voltage so it should be more tolerant to the higher voltage.


Thanks for the advice! I've been implementing boards all over my projects so I do have a mix of the old and newer boards. I did take a volt meter to the adapter since it was not labelled and it is a steady 15V DC, so I too think it will work.

Hope all is well, and the real world is being kind!


----------



## dommyboy

Different question this time! Has anybody tried the MDFLY micro SD mp3 player? The tech specs for the larger SD mp3 player list 6-12v input, and this one only lists 12v input, so I was wondering if it would be compatible. I'm trying to reduce the overall profile if I can and I do have a few micro SD's floating around the house!

Thanks everybody!

http://www.mdfly.com/products/tf-microsd-card-mp3-player-module.html


----------



## scubaspook

It will work with the controller since the controllers power supply is 12vdc however I would be hesitant on using the 15vdc supply you mentioned earlier.


----------



## dommyboy

scubaspook said:


> It will work with the controller since the controllers power supply is 12vdc however I would be hesitant on using the 15vdc supply you mentioned earlier.


Thanks Scuba! Yeah, after reading the tech specs on the board I was definitely not going to attempt a 15V supply. Thanks again for the help!


----------



## Mav9709

I have built one of the original boards and love it and I am in the process of ordering a couple more for a MIB and an exploding fuse box (I know, how original, but I am new) but I am also planning on buying one of the Frankenstein boards from Halstaff. Are the sound boards the same for both boards? When I order from MDFLY, I want to make only one purchase if possible and they currently have them in stock.


----------



## halstaff

Mav9709 said:


> I have built one of the original boards and love it and I am in the process of ordering a couple more for a MIB and an exploding fuse box (I know, how original, but I am new) but I am also planning on buying one of the Frankenstein boards from Halstaff. Are the sound boards the same for both boards? When I order from MDFLY, I want to make only one purchase if possible and they currently have them in stock.


Yes, they both use the same audio board - http://www.mdfly.com/products/sd-card-mp3-player-module-rs232-ttl.html but order quickly as they're going fast.


----------



## DanoNJ

halstaff said:


> Yes, they both use the same audio board - http://www.mdfly.com/products/sd-card-mp3-player-module-rs232-ttl.html but order quickly as they're going fast.


I was too late.... out of stock.


----------



## EvilEye

halstaff said:


> Yes, they both use the same audio board - but order quickly as they're going fast.


Hmmm, I wonder why 

I too was late in getting them when Halstaff let me know they had some in-stock the other day. But there are 25, make that 23, of the micro-SD versions in-stock.


----------



## scream1973

Is the Rj45s for the remote and Controller built on the PCB already because i didnt see it on the BOM list and didnt wanna have to put together another order if it was just missed off the list... Just checking before i put together my components order


----------



## scubaspook

The rj45's are not built in. Tayda does not carry the rj45 connector so you will need to order those somewhere else. I will post when I get home where I got mine from. Also if you are using the new boards be sure to order the diodes.


----------



## scream1973

Diodes are a check.. Ok i will place my Tayda order then.. Mdfly carry the Rj45 ?


----------



## scubaspook

This is what I got. If you don't order from this link just be sure to look at the pins carefully as I bought a bunch that didn't fit. http://www.ebay.com/itm/10PCS-RJ45-...843?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item418411fdd3


----------



## scream1973

Done and Done.. thank ya sir.. now to just wait for everything to show up and hope my rusty soldering skills are up to par


----------



## Mav9709

Thanks for link for the RJ-45 connectors Scubaspook. I just placed my order from Tayda and could not find them.


----------



## Abunai

I've programmed and used a couple of these controllers so far in building and testing my props for this year. They've worked great.

Today I went to program the final prop action for use this October, and decided I wanted to add a 1 minute trigger delay, which I hadn't done before. I went into set up mode and followed the audio instructions: pressing 1 for 1 minute of trigger delay, then pressing record and recording my sequence. 

When I played it back, and triggered it. The controller re-created the movement, played the in-action audio, then began playing the ambient audio....then stopped playing the ambient audio at the end of the track.....waited for one minute....then started playing it again. 

That's not how it's supposed to work, is it? 
Shouldn't it be playing the ambient audio even during the trigger delay period?
Did I program something wrong?
Is there a procedure to return to factory default settings?
Is there a better place for me to be asking these question?


----------



## tstraub

Abunai said:


> I've programmed and used a couple of these controllers so far in building and testing my props for this year. They've worked great.
> 
> Today I went to program the final prop action for use this October, and decided I wanted to add a 1 minute trigger delay, which I hadn't done before. I went into set up mode and followed the audio instructions: pressing 1 for 1 minute of trigger delay, then pressing record and recording my sequence.
> 
> When I played it back, and triggered it. The controller re-created the movement, played the in-action audio, then began playing the ambient audio....then stopped playing the ambient audio at the end of the track.....waited for one minute....then started playing it again.
> 
> That's not how it's supposed to work, is it?
> Shouldn't it be playing the ambient audio even during the trigger delay period?
> Did I program something wrong?
> Is there a procedure to return to factory default settings?
> Is there a better place for me to be asking these question?


Hello

What you are describing sounds to me like the controller is working as designed. You are experiencing the silent period because your ambient audio track is shorter than the delay period. The controller only starts the ambient track once during the delay period. My suggestion is that you open the MP3 file in your choice om MP3 editing software and copy and paste the entire track onto the end of itself. You might have to paste it on a few times depending on how long the sound clip is. What you need is 1 file that repeats as many times as it takes to cover the delay period.

When you put the new MP3 file onto the SD card you will need to save all of the files to your computer and format the SD card and drag the files over 1 at a time like when you set up the SD card the first time.

If you would like to turn the delay back off the procedure to do it is the same as how you enabled it. the only difference is that instead of pressing the numbered buttons to choose a delay time just press the record button to exit.


----------



## Abunai

Thanks. I'll lengthen the track.


----------



## scream1973

Soldered my first one up last night. have to add the mp3 player and then test it all out and see whats what.. 

One the remote the one section off the side is that for a 3 pin header for PIR ?
Since i didnt see anything in the documentation on it at all


----------



## tstraub

The 3 pin header on the remote serves the same function as the one on the PCB. You can connect a PIR, reed switch, push button switch, or other trigger device to it. Since cat5 comes in longer lengths than servo cable generally does it makes it easier to place the trigger device further from your controller.


----------



## SavageEye

@TStraub - What is the "Sig +/-" for? The main controller looks like there is a 3 pin soldered on and the remote has nothing.


----------



## Abunai

The three pin sig/+/- jack is for the trigger.


----------



## tstraub

Yes a 3 pin header goes there both on the controller and the remote. It is for the trigger when 5 volts is applied to the Sig pin the prop will trigger. Most people like to use a PIR as a trigger but you can also use a magnetic reed switch, push button, break beam sensor, step mat, or other other such devices to trigger the prop. 

The header is included on the remote as well to make it easy to mount your trigger further from the controller if you desire. Since Cat-5 cable is cheap and available in much longer lengths than you can typically find 3 wire servo cable.


----------



## scream1973

Will the Sig Pin take a 12V signal as it looks like some of the PIRS i have output 12V.. i have to do some testing to ensure that but from the documentation it appears that its 12V on the "out" so i have + - Out 

Or am i going to look something trying to use those PIRS ?


----------



## tstraub

The trigger is 5 volt and will not tolerate a 12 volt input. Do you have a link to the PIRs you have? some PIRs will operate on a wide voltage range. Since the trigger header will only be powering the PIR with 5 volts the PIR should only output 5 volts. but I would have to see the specs to be sure that it's OK to use.


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## scream1973

I have these... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Wired-PIR-M...191279950073?ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSA:US:3160

And these as well ..http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-PIR-IR-...869?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e90e3db95


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## Monsterman

dommyboy said:


> Different question this time! Has anybody tried the MDFLY micro SD mp3 player? The tech specs for the larger SD mp3 player list 6-12v input, and this one only lists 12v input, so I was wondering if it would be compatible. I'm trying to reduce the overall profile if I can and I do have a few micro SD's floating around the house!
> 
> Thanks everybody!
> 
> http://www.mdfly.com/products/tf-microsd-card-mp3-player-module.html


I can confirm the micro SD version works fine with this controller. Just built one today using the micro. Also want to take a sec to say Thank You Tyler for the fast response and for offering this board. Top notch!


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## dommyboy

Thanks for the follow up on the micro sd, I forgot to sneak in and let everybody know that it works great and greatly reduces the profile. 

Yet another question...I use one of these boards as more of an experimental board (interchanging parts and seeing what mods I can and can't make, both with hardware and software). I accidentally burnt off a metal plate on a through hole for the voltage regulator. Does anybody know if there is a repair that would work for this or have I now created a "parts board" for myself?!

No biggie either way, I was just wondering if anybody had any ideas. I tried just working with it and soldering in a new regulator but that didn't seam to work (I don't know if I overheated the regulator and burnt it up or if the bad through hole has caused issues further down the board. 

Thanks!


----------



## tstraub

dommyboy said:


> Yet another question...I use one of these boards as more of an experimental board (interchanging parts and seeing what mods I can and can't make, both with hardware and software). I accidentally burnt off a metal plate on a through hole for the voltage regulator. Does anybody know if there is a repair that would work for this or have I now created a "parts board" for myself?!
> Thanks!


Nearly all mistakes can be repaired if you are willing to put the effort into it. Can you get a picture of the damaged area of the PCB so we can get a better idea of what we are dealing with. I know it is sometimes hard to get a good picture of A pcb. They always seem to be out of focus and have a bad glare if you use a flash. I always have the best luck by using the marco setting, no flash and lots of ambient light.

I like the way you try to change things and modify the controller on your own. That's part of the reason I call this the learning controller. The controller learns the sequence of events to run your prop. The user learns some soldering skills and possibly a little circuit design and coding. Most of what I know is self taught from doing these sort of things with other peoples stuff. Starting with a working product then breaking it and bringing it back to life can help you learn what makes it works.


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## dommyboy

Thanks Tyler! It appears that the silver for the through hole is pretty damaged on 2 of the 3 voltage regulator holes. Here are some pics:



















This is the only board that has given me issues, but it's been through a lot of mods along the way, both hardware and software. I think the last time a regulator pin broke that was the last straw (3rd regulator I had to change out). Below is my favorite mod configuration, with a 2.1 mm power connector and removable terminal blocks for easy wiring. I also recently reprogrammed the ambient sound to switch songs every time the trigger goes off, adding quite the diversity to the haunt!










Thanks again!


----------



## Onewish1

Two quick questions, Will a 12v 1a regulated be ok to power the board and using a separate power supply for the triggers what is the max voltage dc can i have and should it be regulated

Thanks


----------



## Socalangler

Hey Tyler, pm sent


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## dommyboy

Onewish1 said:


> Two quick questions, Will a 12v 1a regulated be ok to power the board and using a separate power supply for the triggers what is the max voltage dc can i have and should it be regulated
> 
> Thanks


The data sheet lists 5-18 volts. I use the 12V 1A all the time - I like to splice off of them for my solenoids. Good luck!

http://www.taydaelectronics.com/datasheets/A-179.pdf


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## Onewish1

Thanks


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## tstraub

Dom,
From the pictures ti looks like you lifted at least pins 2(center) and 3(lower) Pin 1 might still be there on the top of the PCB. soldering to the traces can be difficult so the easiest thing to do is to simply replace the trace with a piece of wire. Pin 2 goes to the ground plane on the bottom side of the PCB. the easiest way to make that repair would be to scrape a bit of the solder mask next to the pad on the bottom side of the PCB then when you install that component you can bend the leg over to the part you scraped and solder it to the ground plane. It will probably take a bit more heat to get a good connection but it is defiantly doable. As for pin 2 I would run a jumper wire on the bottom side of the PCB from that leg of the component over to the center pin of the trigger header. Pin 1 I would just solder in place like normal then get out your DVOM and check for continuity between the end that pad and the pads it connects to. the traces are on the top side of the PCB so it is easy to see where you should see continuity. If you plan to keep using this PCB I would suggest that you install a socket rather than a regulator so that you can swap the regulator later without un soldering it. a 3 pin section of the same female header used for the MP3 module should make a good socket.

Nice job on the mods. looks great


----------



## dommyboy

tstraub said:


> Dom from the pictures ti looks like you lifted at least pins 2(center) and 3(lower) Pin 1 might still be there on the top of the PCB. soldering to the traces can be difficult so the easiest thing to do is to simply replace the trace with a piece of wire. Pin 2 goes to the ground plane on the bottom side of the PCB. the easiest way to make that repair would be to scrape a bit of the solder mask next to the pad on the bottom side of the PCB then when you install that component you can bend the leg over to the part you scraped and solder it to the ground plane. It will probably take a bit more heat to get a good connection but it is defiantly doable. as for pin 2 I would run a jumper wire from that leg of the component


I also picked up some silver solder glue as well (of course it is coming via slow boat from China so it will take month to reach me) but I figured I could fix the trace with that too. Seemed like a nice option to have a moldable silver that will take 1-2 hours to dry but is conductive.

What do you think?


----------



## tstraub

I have never used solder glue but I assume it would work as long as you can get the solder mask cleaned off the trace well enough to make a good connection. BTW I edited the above post and added info about using a socket while you were replying so make sure you go back and read that part.


----------



## dommyboy

Thanks Tyler! I'll let you know how the glue works, it looks that by using it and the syringe it comes with I should be easily able to re-estalblish contact with the traces. Take care!


----------



## Monsterman

dommyboy,

I love how you added the removable terminal blocks. I was thinking of doing that but did not know if they would fit. So... next time I will be doing that for sure!! Next time I think I will also try to add a 3 pin screw terminal in for the trigger. It will make it much easier for using a variety of triggers. Plus it's much easier to cut the 3pin plug off a PIR and screw the wires under screws then to modify other trigger items to work off a straight pin header.


----------



## dommyboy

Monsterman said:


> dommyboy,
> 
> I love how you added the removable terminal blocks. I was thinking of doing that but did not know if they would fit. So... next time I will be doing that for sure!! Next time I think I will also try to add a 3 pin screw terminal in for the trigger. It will make it much easier for using a variety of triggers. Plus it's much easier to cut the 3pin plug off a PIR and screw the wires under screws then to modify other trigger items to work off a straight pin header.


The removable terminal blocks are great, but they are an extremely tight fit. The through holes are probably one size too small, but with a bit of effort you can get them in. Just don't ever expect to take them out!


----------



## Monsterman

Ok finally got my RJ45 jacks from that slow boat from china and now I can post up some pics of my completed controller(s).

On one controller I added an extra 3.5mm headphone jack for a talking skull prop of mine, as you will see in the pics. I also made an enclosure out of some plexi, pop rivets, pc standoffs and cable clamps (fyi a 1/8 hole is just the right size to screw the standoffs into). My 12v 1A regulated switching PSU (from evilBay) is mounted to the enclosure to keep things neat. (The enclosure looks better in person then in these pics. In the pics it looks a bit sloppy where I added silicone to eliminate the cracks where the sides meet.) Oh you will also get a look at the micro SD board as well. Thanks again Tyler for bringing this to us


----------



## tstraub

Looks great. I like the clear enclosure it shows off your soldering skills


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## scream1973

much better soldering then mine
i do like the enclosure.. where did you get it


----------



## Monsterman

scream1973 said:


> much better soldering then mine
> i do like the enclosure.. where did you get it


The real trick to soldering, as I'm sure Tyler and others may agree is that you need to use a fine diameter solder and a decent soldering iron. Those elcheap-o ones will do the job, but most times have poor and uneven heat transfer. It seems like it's either too hot or it takes forever to heat the location. I currently use a Weller WTCPT (60 Watts) with a fine tip. It does not have an adjustable temp dial, but it works well and heats fast. coupled with Radio Shack High-Tech Rosin-Core Silver-Bearing Solder .022 dia. 62/36/2% P/N: 64-013 E.

The enclosure is just regular sheet plexiglass that you can buy at any home improvement store. Cut about a ½ wider then the board and about ½ taller then the mp3 board. Then hooked together into a box shape with pop rivets and small cable/ground wire clips (you could also use angle brackets and or some old parts form an erector set bent to 90°). The top slides under 5 of the clips and is held up by 2 plexi rails I riveted on just below the rim. To make the square hole for the RJ45 access I lol took a small torch and heated a flat wood chisel and melted a square hole in the plexi because I did not think to cut a notch out before putting the box together. Just basically made it out of a bunch of stuff I had laying around. Note if you try this design it uses A LOT of rivets (43 I think)

I forgot to add a pic of the little tray I made for the remote so here it is.


----------



## tstraub

Monsterman said:


> The real trick to soldering, as I'm sure Tyler and others may agree is that you need to use a fine diameter solder and a decent soldering iron. Those elcheap-o ones will do the job, but most times have poor and uneven heat transfer. It seems like it's either too hot or it takes forever to heat the location.


Absolutely, as with anything having the right tool for the job makes things go a lot easier. a cheap iron can make some good solder joints. The thing is that in order to get this controller together you need to make upwards of 150 good solder joints in a row. One bad joint can make the whole controller or any part of it not work. A cheap iron starts out too cold and gets too hot by the time you are done. You will likely still end up with a working controller in the end even with a cheap iron. Its just going to be more difficult than it needs to be.

Tyler


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## scream1973

Im using a 40watt weller.. And happy to say my controllers worked.. i had to resolder one diode connection on one of them..

Now another question.. Will it work.. or can the code be changed to work if my PIR is NC instead of NO..?


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## grismcdonald

Just got around to testing my four builds. 3 worked flawlessly but one blew the channel 4 LED at power up. Any ideas? It appears that it was properly positioned. 

Thanks
Gris


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## tstraub

scream1973 said:


> Im using a 40watt weller.. And happy to say my controllers worked.. i had to resolder one diode connection on one of them..
> 
> Now another question.. Will it work.. or can the code be changed to work if my PIR is NC instead of NO..?


I don't think it's going to be as easy as a firmware change for you. The problem you are going to run into is that the PIR trigger shares a pin on the PIC16F688 chip with button #4. Since the resistors on the PCB are setup for active high it will try to trigger any time button #4 is not pressed. unless you already have a bunch of active low PIR you are trying to use up. The PIRs Scuba linked are cheap and work well it's probably easiest to just get those.

If you really want to try to make the other PIRs work I would suggest you build some sort of inverter circuit to go between the PIR and the controller to change it's output. It could probably be done with a transistor and a few resistors. Google how to invert a digital signal and you'll get plenty of examples.

Tyler


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## tstraub

grismcdonald said:


> Just got around to testing my four builds. 3 worked flawlessly but one blew the channel 4 LED at power up. Any ideas? It appears that it was properly positioned.
> 
> Thanks
> Gris


So the LED came on even though channel 4 was not active then burned out? If so I bet you caught the ground plane when you soldered either the LED cathode or the right side of current limiting resistor (R5). Under normal operation The LEDs are powered(12volts) all the time then they turn on when they are grounded by the ULN2803 chip threw a 1K resistor. It sounds to me like the current fund its way to ground without first going threw the resistor.

Get out your ohm meter and check the resistance of R5 with the controller not connected to power. A normal reading would be close 1,000 ohms 1K. A reading of close to zero ohms(without the K) would indicate a short.

Tyler


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## scream1973

tstraub said:


> I don't think it's going to be as easy as a firmware change for you. The problem you are going to run into is that the PIR trigger shares a pin on the PIC16F688 chip with button #4. Since the resistors on the PCB are setup for active high it will try to trigger any time button #4 is not pressed. unless you already have a bunch of active low PIR you are trying to use up. The PIRs Scuba linked are cheap and work well it's probably easiest to just get those.
> 
> If you really want to try to make the other PIRs work I would suggest you build some sort of inverter circuit to go between the PIR and the controller to change it's output. It could probably be done with a transistor and a few resistors. Google how to invert a digital signal and you'll get plenty of examples.
> 
> Tyler


Ok cool thanks.. 
I'll will use the NC PIRS i have with my Nerve Centers and then use the other PIRs I have / Paralaxx PIRs with this controller.. The NCs are just nicely enclosed already so figured i'd ask the question.


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## grismcdonald

So got around to looking over the solider job on this one. Out of the six I have built, this one gets the low grade. So, I installed a new LED on channel 4 and did sone separating/scraping of the contacts and it fired up. Here are the New issues. First, I only have one channel of audio. Next, started record and it responded with the second track. All channels responded except channel 1. When I pushed channel 1, the controller went into the setup mode. I could program with only 2-4 and it would play back but occasionally would end sequence with all 4 channels being activated. 
I then used the same MP3 module in another board and it work flawlessly. Any suggestions? My thought is that is has affected one of the chips

Thanks 

Gris


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## tstraub

Gris,

It sounds like you still have 2 separate problems try reflowing the solder joints on the audio jack and pins 17 and 18 of the MP3 player socket. I bet that will get your other audio channel going.

As far as the switches not responding correctly Try the following steps to test the switches:

Remove the PIC16F688 chip 

Power up the controller and test the voltage at pin 3 of the socket while pressing all of the buttons one at a time voltage should be 5 volts with the Record switch pressed and 0 volts with any other switch pressed

Test for voltage at pin 5 this time you should have 5 volts when pressing switch 2 and 0 volts when any other switch is pressed

Test for voltage at pin 6 this time you should have 5 volts when pressing switch 3 and 0 volts when any other switch is pressed

Test for voltage at pin 7 this time you should have 5 volts when pressing switch 4 and 0 volts when any other switch is pressed

If all of the switches test OK try PICs with one of your working controllers and see if the problem follows the PIC or the controller.

Let me know the results of your test and we'll go from there.

Tyler


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## grismcdonald

Tyler
Kinda did it backwards. Checked solder joints on 17,18 pins of MP3 socket and all looked good. Checked continuity between pins and phono jack and all checked out. Maybe a bad jack. Pulled chips out of board in question and installed in a working board and it performed as expected. All channels and sound. 
Moved back to board in question and started checking voltage as you suggested. I think in your previous post you omitted checking button 1 and pin 4. All of the other have 5v when button was pushed except the pin 4/button 1. Started checking continuity across push buttons and seemed to check out but probing I got continuity across R11 and no other. 

Just checked it and no resistance reading across r11. If replaced, should that fix in?

Thanks Gris


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## tstraub

By no resistance reading do you mean 0 ohms out infinity. There is a big difference so we need to be clear. It's probably safe to assume 0 ohms since you said you got cotinunty elsewhere in the post. One end of that resistor is tied to ground so if you measure 0 ohms you most likely got the ground plane with the other side or the switch. Also check the audio output pins for continuity to ground I bet you'll find its shorted too.

I'm at a loss as to how you got the ground plane 3 times on this board after no issues with all the rest. Maybe the tip needs replaced on your iron. Maybe the PCB was under etched from the factory. Maybe the solder mask was too thin or scratched in shipping. I really don't know. Let me know what you find.


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## Death Wraith

There are so many posts and videos about this controller that I can't find the answer to my basic noob question: how do I hook up 12v solenoids? Can I wire them directly to the relays? If so, where goes positive and where goes negative? Seems basic but I need to know.

Thanks


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## tstraub

The relay outputs do not have any power to them by design this is so it will work with many different voltage. You wire them up just like you would wire up a toggle switch. If you want to turn something on power goes in the terminal marked C(common) then run a wire from the terminal marked NO(normally open) to your load. Then the ground goes back to the negative side of you power source. If you want to turn something off use the C and NC terminals


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## Death Wraith

Thanks for the reminder. Thats just how it is with the Nerve Center, the only other controller I've ever used. Thanks for all the help and the good work on these controllers.


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## the_PROCRASTINATOR

Very cool! Thank you for sharing!


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## Jack Is Back

*Hacked for something else*

So I've assembled 6 of these boards over the last couple of years and needed a custom mod. I have the Frightprops Triggerable Digital Video Player and made a scare mirror over a old monitor. You can play up to 7 different tracks of video but the device has separate input triggers. My original plan was to build a custom 7 relay board using a PIC to cycle through the videos but never got the time.

So I redid the code for LPC to stop the learning and simply cycle through the relays every time it gets triggered. I flashed the PIC with the new code and voila I'm done.

I was even thinking of chaining two together to take advantage of all 7 video tracks. Have the first one be a master to signal the second once it's played 3 tracks, then reset to 1 after the second has been triggered 4 times. Then again maybe not.

Thanks again for such a great controller!!!! :googly:


----------



## tstraub

Jack Is Back said:


> So I've assembled 6 of these boards over the last couple of years and needed a custom mod. I have the Frightprops Triggerable Digital Video Player and made a scare mirror over a old monitor. You can play up to 7 different tracks of video but the device has separate input triggers. My original plan was to build a custom 7 relay board using a PIC to cycle through the videos but never got the time.
> 
> So I redid the code for LPC to stop the learning and simply cycle through the relays every time it gets triggered. I flashed the PIC with the new code and voila I'm done.
> 
> I was even thinking of chaining two together to take advantage of all 7 video tracks. Have the first one be a master to signal the second once it's played 3 tracks, then reset to 1 after the second has been triggered 4 times. Then again maybe not.
> 
> Thanks again for such a great controller!!!! :googly:


Great outside the box thinking! You seem to be pretty comfortable making mods so here is a suggestion on how to get all 7 video tracks from 1 controller. Since you are running a video I assume you are not using the MP3 module. You can gain access to 2 more GPIO pins threw that header (RC1 and RC2) you can also repurpose RA5(currently driving the record LED). Then take all 3 of these outputs to the unused pins of the ULN2803 chip. It has 8 darlington transistors in it but only 4 are used. Then attach 3 more relays to the outputs of the 2803 chip. Finally make use of these pins in your firmware. Easy Peasy

It should be easy enough to follow the traces on the PCB to find all the correct pins. The board is only 2 layers nothing hidden on the inside. But if you would like a schematic PM me with your email address and I'll get you a copy.


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## zoluf09

*controller*

This controller is awesome! That is all.


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## Jack Is Back

tstraub said:


> Great outside the box thinking! You seem to be pretty comfortable making mods so here is a suggestion on how to get all 7 video tracks from 1 controller. Since you are running a video I assume you are not using the MP3 module. You can gain access to 2 more GPIO pins threw that header (RC1 and RC2) you can also repurpose RA5(currently driving the record LED). Then take all 3 of these outputs to the unused pins of the ULN2803 chip. It has 8 darlington transistors in it but only 4 are used. Then attach 3 more relays to the outputs of the 2803 chip. Finally make use of these pins in your firmware. Easy Peasy
> 
> It should be easy enough to follow the traces on the PCB to find all the correct pins. The board is only 2 layers nothing hidden on the inside. But if you would like a schematic PM me with your email address and I'll get you a copy.


That sounds easy enough but time is not on my side right now. But I would love a schematic so I can work on it for next year.


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## JKGravy

Will the voltage regulated work with 14.6V input?


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## rkkcarver

I'm building my first controller and have some questions can anyone help? I got some PCB from Tyler (*tstraub) and am confused about a few things 1 the diagram of the 4 diodes next to the voltage controller & MP3 player. 2 There is a spot at the other end of the board next to the chips labeled remote, what is this for? 3. The audio jack out put I'm assuming one goes to + and one to the - side dose it matter which yay it is orientated? *


----------



## JKGravy

rkkcarver said:


> I'm building my first controller and have some questions can anyone help? I got some PCB from Tyler (*tstraub) and am confused about a few things 1 the diagram of the 4 diodes next to the voltage controller & MP3 player. 2 There is a spot at the other end of the board next to the chips labeled remote, what is this for? 3. The audio jack out put I'm assuming one goes to + and one to the - side dose it matter which yay it is orientated? *


You may have went off the old BOM, the new BOM has the right 3.5 mm jack and the anodes. The remote is for a rj-45 jack, this is only for the remote option.


----------



## Jack Is Back

So I fried my first controller. Luckily there was no Tenda card installed and the pic survive. The transistor array made a nice pop and a 470uf cap doesn't look too good. Hopefully after the holiday I can replace the parts and everything will work again.

Maybe I need some of the new design. 😢


----------



## scubaspook

Jack Is Back said:


> So I fried my first controller. Luckily there was no Tenda card installed and the pic survive. The transistor array made a nice pop and a 470uf cap doesn't look too good. Hopefully after the holiday I can replace the parts and everything will work again.
> 
> Maybe I need some of the new design. &#55357;&#56866;


 I have only known one other controller that this has happened to and the cause was ac voltage was applied to it. After reading past post I am pretty sure this was not your case but check just to be sure.


----------



## tstraub

Jack Is Back said:


> So I fried my first controller. Luckily there was no Tenda card installed and the pic survive. The transistor array made a nice pop and a 470uf cap doesn't look too good. Hopefully after the holiday I can replace the parts and everything will work again.
> 
> Maybe I need some of the new design. &#128546;


I can loan you one of my spare controllers if you need it to get threw the holiday. Just shoot me a pm with your shipping info.


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## Jack Is Back

scubaspook said:


> I have only known one other controller that this has happened to and the cause was ac voltage was applied to it. After reading past post I am pretty sure this was not your case but check just to be sure.


No it was definitely 12VDC and I'm an idiot. I have a common 12VDC power line that runs from an ATX PS. On that line I have quick connectors at various intervals that I tap into where needed. I use female plugs for + and male plugs for -. The controller was plugged in and running for days and it was all good. I added another controller further down in the haunt and disconnected the one and moved it downstream. Of course that was the one set of quick connect plugs I had installed incorrectly.



tstraub said:


> I can loan you one of my spare controllers if you need it to get threw the holiday. Just shoot me a pm with your shipping info.


Thanks Tyler but I'm okay. I built 6 controllers over the winter but have only used 1 so far and I only need 2 more this year. I would love to see the schematic for you added diodes. I could fabricate some daughter boards to install between the controller and any future screwups by me.


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## Hellspawn

When hooking up a push button trigger, do you hook it up to the pins labeled + and sig? I want to make sure before I fry something.

the Sig pin will trigger the controller when 5 volts is introduced to it, so I assume that I can just bridge the pos and sig pins with my trigger.... or am I way off here?


----------



## tstraub

Jack Is Back said:


> Thanks Tyler but I'm okay. I built 6 controllers over the winter but have only used 1 so far and I only need 2 more this year. I would love to see the schematic for you added diodes. I could fabricate some daughter boards to install between the controller and any future screwups by me.


I sent a PDF file of the schematic to your email. If you need any help getting that controller going again let me know. I would start with changing the electrolytic caps, unl2803 chip and possibly the Vreg. The regulator is probably OK but I would go ahead and get a few coming when you place your parts order. You will need add something to the order anyway just to meet the $5 minimum order. So might as well get a few spares coming.


----------



## tstraub

Hellspawn said:


> When hooking up a push button trigger, do you hook it up to the pins labeled + and sig? I want to make sure before I fry something.
> 
> the Sig pin will trigger the controller when 5 volts is introduced to it, so I assume that I can just bridge the pos and sig pins with my trigger.... or am I way off here?


You are exactly right. If you connect a push button switch between the + and signal you'll be all set. Electrically your switch will function just like the #4 test button on the PCB. You could also connect your switch pins 1(switch input) and 4(+5volts) of the remote connector on the new style PCBs.


----------



## Hellspawn

tstraub said:


> You are exactly right. If you connect a push button switch between the + and signal you'll be all set. Electrically your switch will function just like the #4 test button on the PCB. You could also connect your switch pins 1(switch input) and 4(+5volts) of the remote connector on the new style PCBs.


Thanks for the reply Tyler, that's what I had thought, I just didn't want to chance it as this is one of the older style boards you sold to Halstaff/Steve when he lead this controller build at our Haunt Group Gathering a couple years ago.


----------



## Jack Is Back

tstraub said:


> I sent a PDF file of the schematic to your email. If you need any help getting that controller going again let me know. I would start with changing the electrolytic caps, unl2803 chip and possibly the Vreg. The regulator is probably OK but I would go ahead and get a few coming when you place your parts order. You will need add something to the order anyway just to meet the $5 minimum order. So might as well get a few spares coming.


Got it and thanks again for all your help. The parts are already on order and shipped.


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## grismcdonald

Last year I had an issue with putting the files on my SD card using my Mac. It seems that I formatted the SD card on the Mac and then copied the four files over. I had issues with the file playback and when I looked at the card on my PC I realized the first format did not wipe the card clean and there were still files on the card not shown on the Mac. Well.... I lost my pc to a lightening strike and only have the Mac. Question is, should I be able to format the SD card and install the four mP3 files using the Mac? I use the Mac to create sound files with Audacity so it would be a lot easier. I just have not tried the Mac for formatting since the original issue last year. 

Gris


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## tstraub

Gris I'm not a Mac user so I have never had to do it on a Mac. I'll share the information I do know and hopefully it will be enough to guide you threw the process. First thing you need to know is that the whole file naming, card formatting, and dragging the files one at a time is not really necessary. The MP3 player does not even read the file names. all it cares about is the file order in the FAT table. The naming and formatting is simply the easiest way to reorder The FAT table on a windows machine without using any 3rd party software. The format destroys the FAT table and draging the files back over rebuilds it. The file naming is just there to guide the users to drag the files in the correct order.

Their are several software choices out there that will let you reorder the Fat table some are free, some are free trials, and some are paid. Since I'm not a Mac user I really can't recommend and one of them over another. If I were you I would head over to your favorite software download site or simply do a google search for FAT table sorting software for Mac. Read the reviews and give one of them a try.

Good luck I'm sure you can get it figured out. When you find the answer please share what you find. I wish I could give you a better answer.

Tyler


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## dommyboy

Another question! The mp3 board is capable of 99 tracks (I believe). Is there an easy way to figure out the coding for subroutines if I want to utilize these additional tracks? 

For instance, I set up a simple counter to reference different subroutines. I'd like to use multiple tracks to mix up my ambient sound, like play5, play6, etc. I am just not seeing the trend on how to assign the right ports via the subroutine. 

No worries if you can't get to this until after the big day next week, it was just a thought I came up with!


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## Jack Is Back

You have to send the hex value of the track you want to play to the Tenda board. I hope you're familiar with binary and hex.

Here is the code to send a hex 01 to the board. 

Sub Play_Ambient_Track	;send hex 01 to MP3 board
set PORTC.1 off ;start bit
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 on
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 off
Wait baud us
set PORTC.1 on ;stop bit
Wait baud us
Wait 200 ms
End Sub

I did the same multiple play coding for my Picaxe based controller boards and it works great. The board itself can play up to 199 tracks.


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## dommyboy

I guess I am less familiar with binary & hex than I thought I was...

I've been comparing the code above with the code to send hex 02, 03, etc to the board, and am not seeing the correlation in code, so it just may be out of my league. I just may have to stick with basic programming!


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## tstraub

You need to send a total of 10 bits. A start bit, 8 data bits, and a stop bit. The data bits are the ones you need to worry about changing. If you wanted to add a routine to play file 5 you need to send a 5. It's 8 bit binary form would be 00000101. But the trick is that you need to send it last significant bit first (little Indian). So you need to send a start bit 10100000 stop bit. 
HTH

Tyler


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## dommyboy

thanks Tyler! That is starting to make some sense to me now...Hope this year's haunting is going well!


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## SavageEye

Dumb question. NO/NC/C. How do I hook up my solenoid? I'm not getting my solenoid to open up.


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## Hellspawn

SavageEye said:


> Dumb question. NO/NC/C. How do I hook up my solenoid? I'm not getting my solenoid to open up.


Take one wire from your solenoid and stick it in the NO port, then, take your power source and put one side into the C (common) port, then twist the remaining wires together, you will have one from the solenoid and the other from your power source.

Most solenoids i have used are not polarity specific, you can wire neg to pos and pos to neg, but yours might be diffrerent.. If you still cant get it to fire, swap the wires.

You will need to have power running with the required voltage to the relay where your solenoid is connected, make sure you are using the correct voltage


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## SavageEye

Thanks Hellspawn. I get what you are saying, however it doesn't make sense from the way the board is set up. The power source is on the other side of the board(?). Do you have a pic by chance? Appreciate the help!


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## Hellspawn

SavageEye said:


> Thanks Hellspawn. I get what you are saying, however it doesn't make sense from the way the board is set up. The power source is on the other side of the board(?). Do you have a pic by chance? Appreciate the help!


Each relay on the board (4) requires a separate power source (with correct voltage) for each thing you want to trigger, the only exception is if you are hooking up a prop that has its own power source and you just need the controller to activate it (like a step pad)

For example, you have a prop that has a solenoid that runs off 12volts, a light that runs off 120volts and a motor that runs off 5 volts, in this scenario, you would be using 3 relays, 1 for the solenoid, 1 for the light and 1 for the motor.

Because each item needs power to run, you need to wire it up, at the relay with the correct voltage.. The power on the other side of the board is just to power the board itself, not anything that is being controlled by it.

So, going off my last reply, if your solenoid runs off 12 volts, you need a 12v power supply for it and it needs to be wired like i explained, 1 wire from the power source goes to the common port, 1 wire from the solenoid goes to the NO port and the two remaining wires are twisted together and protected by a wire nut or electrical tape.

If you want a light to be active while the controller is in rest, wire it to the NC port

I will try and upload a picture but i dont have access to a pc right now, just my ipad..

Reply with your email address and ill email you a picture how i have mine setup.


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## dommyboy

so, to send a 6 to the mp3 board, we would send: start bit 01100000 stop bit

I think I am on track!


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## SavageEye

Hellspawn... You are a life saver man!!! Works like a charm! Thanks Buddy!


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## Hellspawn

SavageEye said:


> Hellspawn... You are a life saver man!!! Works like a charm! Thanks Buddy!


Really glad i could help


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## SavageEye

@ Tstraub - Great board! Thanks for putting this together! I think that a lightning controller would be a great addition... (Hint, Hint)

@ Hellspawn - Thanks again for the last minute help. It really came together thanks to you!


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## tstraub

Will, I'm glad to hear that you are pleased with the controller. As far as a lightning controller goes I really don't think I could do any that ScaryLane has not already done with his Thor system http://www.haunthackers.com/thor2/index.shtml I have not seen the Thor system in person but I have talked to Steve(ScaryLane) over video chat several times and it sounds like a great product.


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## scream1973

Looks like i have some troubleshooting to do with my boards.. when i went to actually make use of them no go.. they wouldnt program.. ..So i am gusesin some bad solder jobs for sure.. grr.. didnt overly troubleshoot tho.. as i was already behind the 8ball.


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## Onewish1

Thank you for a great product and instructions. . Went off without a hitch.. the boards worked great!


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## Jack Is Back

Yes, thanks for a great controller. People were amazed that everything was animated this year in my Haunted House. Audio was fantastic and even my customized board worked flawlessly. 

I can't wait until next time. Hope everyone had a great Halloween.


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## grismcdonald

Had an issue with getting my PIR sensor to work. I bought several last year and they worked with both of my boards but could not get them to work this year. Bought some new ones and they too did not work. Had to use my Quarum sensors


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## Onewish1

fun stuff.. thank you Tyler!!!


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## dommyboy

Today was a sad day, I had to say R.I.P. to my first board. To no design flaw of the board, it fell victim to too many modifications I'd made to it as my "test" board and I was unable to repair it after several attempts and many hours of work. Today I finally salvaged all the parts I could off of it and laid the poor guy to rest. 

These boards are incredible, and I can't thank Tyler enough for such a fantastic product! This board took an immense amount of abuse before I finally killed it.


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## Onewish1

Lol


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## beeiilll

Just found this thread and was wondering if any pre-etched boards are still available for this project? Great idea that would work for a couple of projects actually for me!


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## jahip

Good morning tstraub,

I am new to this form and I hope that I am not overstepping it by sending you this message.
I am intersted in you controller do you still have them avaiable? I have never tryied to make a pc so I don't know how hard it will be but want to try I looked on the vendor board but could not find you.

thanks 
Johnny


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## toozie21

Whoops, wrong thread....


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## BobbyA

jahip said:


> Good morning tstraub,
> 
> I am new to this form and I hope that I am not overstepping it by sending you this message.
> I am intersted in you controller do you still have them avaiable? I have never tryied to make a pc so I don't know how hard it will be but want to try I looked on the vendor board but could not find you.
> 
> thanks
> Johnny


Hi, I'm not sure when Tyler will get a chance to answer so I thought I'd help out. You can PM Tyler, he is the place to get the PCB and many parts like the programmed PIC processor. If you are looking for an assembled unit scubaspook1 sells them, along with a power supply, and PIR trigger. He also has the new model with the remote programming board. He may be on here, but he also has a thread on the For sale by vendor section of halloweenforum. Hope it helps. 
P.S. I own 3 of the controllers that I assembled, if you can solder they are not hard to do.


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## jahip

Thanks BobbyA for the responce. I did PM Tyler but it said his box is full and will not send. I will look up Scubaspook1 and go this route for now, I am sure everyone is busy with the build season comeing up.


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## scream1973

Have a weird issue with one of my boards.. 
Power it on and it plays track 003 .. you hit the button to select the time and then it plays track 001 and you cant really program it .. 

Card is setup correctly as the same card works in another board.. Any ideas?


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## tstraub

scream1973 said:


> Have a weird issue with one of my boards..
> Power it on and it plays track 003 .. you hit the button to select the time and then it plays track 001 and you cant really program it ..
> 
> Card is setup correctly as the same card works in another board.. Any ideas?


Am I correct to assume that you do have 1 controller that is working correctly? If so my suggestion is that you try swaping the following parts from the non working controller into the one that works. With the power disconnected one at a time move the SD card, MP3 module and the PIC16F688 chip from the non working controller into the currently working controller.

When you find out which part the issue follows report back and we can further diagnose this issue ind decide where we need to look closer or possiably replace one of the parts. Also if you can get a few high resolution pictures of both the top and bottom side of the PCB that could also be helpful.

Tyler


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## scream1973

tstraub said:


> Am I correct to assume that you do have 1 controller that is working correctly? If so my suggestion is that you try swaping the following parts from the non working controller into the one that works. With the power disconnected one at a time move the SD card, MP3 module and the PIC16F688 chip from the non working controller into the currently working controller.
> 
> When you find out which part the issue follows report back and we can further diagnose this issue ind decide where we need to look closer or possiably replace one of the parts. Also if you can get a few high resolution pictures of both the top and bottom side of the PCB that could also be helpful.
> 
> Tyler


Sounds good Tyler.. Yes my 1 board appears to be functional as expected once i cleaned up some of the joints. I am using the same SD card in both boards so i can rule that out .

I'll try moving the Mp3 module over and the PIC to see if we can see any differences.. and then take some hi res pictures..


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## rkkcarver

Dose any one know what Diodes I need to order for the prop controller. They are on the board by the audio jack. they weren't on the original BOM. If anyone has a part # and could let me know thanks


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## scubaspook

Believe it is a 1N4002 diode


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## scream1973

Ok i swapped the card , and mp3 module out of the non-working board and moved them to the working board and they worked.. Which chip is the one to pull the longer one or the shorter one for the last one?

I'll post pics of the board once i upload them


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## scream1973

http://www.hauntforum.com/album.php?albumid=1692


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## scream1973

http://www.hauntforum.com/album.php?albumid=1692


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## scream1973

Just giving this a lil bump


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## Socalangler

The shorter one


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## sohhh

I want to have a hand trigger for the Tstraub board. I'm finding just about anything I attach to the SIG pin triggers the system, prior to even hooking up a button. When I cross the + and SIG with nothing attached, it gets triggered as well. Any suggestions?


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## sohhh

I also see that when the + and - are crossed on the block of three pins there, it gets triggered. Is that an approach I can take?


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## scubaspook

sohhh said:


> I also see that when the + and - are crossed on the block of three pins there, it gets triggered. Is that an approach I can take?


Do not cross the + and - pins. How long is the wire that you are using and what kind of wire is it (cheap speaker wire or what)?


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## grismcdonald

Scubaspook
I have had similar problem with PIR sensors and was wondering is it was cheap wire. I used a solid 22-24 g bell wire twisted together. Length was 6-12'. Also used the same setup with the Quarium sensors from Electronic Goldmine. Have been wondering if the wire was the problem. What should I be using?

Thanks Gris


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## sohhh

scubaspook said:


> Do not cross the + and - pins. How long is the wire that you are using and what kind of wire is it (cheap speaker wire or what)?


Interesting.

Anything beyond a very short length of wire (with the female ends from my Arduino stuff) caused the issue. I'll gladly use whatever you recommend as an alternative if you think it is a wire issue. I'll try some alternatives now and see what happens!


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## sohhh

scubaspook said:


> Do not cross the + and - pins. How long is the wire that you are using and what kind of wire is it (cheap speaker wire or what)?


Ok, soldered heavy speaker wire onto headers and attached an industrial switch and it works! It seems like overkill. For a hand trigger, what header, wire and switch is recommended?

FYI - It's for a kids haunted house so some of the little ones don't get the full treatment.


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## scubaspook

I have tried on of these and it works. http://www.ebay.com/itm/161804640378?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT No need to run the heavy guage speaker wire.


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## sohhh

scubaspook said:


> I have tried on of these and it works. http://www.ebay.com/itm/161804640378?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT No need to run the heavy guage speaker wire.


Ok, I ordered it.

What do you use to connect to the pins on the board? Thanks!


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## grismcdonald

Still curious about using the twisted 22g wire with the PIR off of eBay or the Quariums. Seems there is a misfire issue. Any comment?


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## sohhh

grismcdonald said:


> Still curious about using the twisted 22g wire with the PIR off of eBay or the Quariums. Seems there is a misfire issue. Any comment?


When I upgraded my wire it fixed the issue I had. I never though that cheap 22g wire would actually matter.

I hope you get it resolved.


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## frijolero

Does anyone know how to get a hold of tstraub?


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## Jack Is Back

Try a PM


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## dommyboy

I have tried via PM - it appears he has gone dark within the forum for a few years now. Unfortunate, as his work was amazing.


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