# My FAILED Experiment in making Glowing Fog



## JonHyers

This if for info only. For YEARS I've asked and heard about the idea of making Glowing Fog. So I just wanted to share what I did, and the effort failed in case anyone was curious. 

Sure you can imagine how COOL Black Light Fog would be, opens up a lot of new ideas for haunters. SO in Nov 2011, I tried it. I bought a $50.00 fogger that did in fact work pretty well, but not the $300 fogger I don't want to ruin. I mixed water based fog, with water based Clear Glow Make-up which is a clear fluid. They mixed nicely, and I added enough so that this new Fog Fluid glowed very nice in black light. But when blown through the fogger, I got fog, but it did not glow under blacklight. SURE it was probably poison, I know that. But for Studio uses, I wanted to do some cool effects.

My guess is, the Glow Compound was Killed by the heater in the fogger. NOTE again, this was to use IN STUDIO with me and my camera, and props, not for customers. BAD idea no doubt, to breath the resulting chemical. I did my test outside with no wind, and some black lights. 

I think in time, someone may have a tech breakthrough, and create a safe to breath glowing fog, I CANT WAIT, but for now there is no way I know of

But I would not bother trying this if you are planning to do it for customers, or an audience....I thought Id share this, because I think it's an interesting experiment and topic that relates to what a lot of us would DREAM of doing. 

Jon Hyers


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## Mr_Chicken

This has come up a few times before, and it's always come down to using colored lights. It certainly would be cool if someone could actually get fog to glow, but once you pull out the black lights, you could probably use colored lights instead, and get a brighter "glow," to boot.


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## Otaku

I wonder if mixing Rit whitener in the fog juice would have any effect? Or maybe tonic water (the quinine in the water glows). A lot of liquid detergents glow under UV, but that would surely kill the fogger.


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## Headless

Tonic water was my first thought too.


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## Gory Corey

think of the composition of fog juice and reasoning behind that composition.
It isnt just a matter of adding a random compound, it is lowering the vaporizing point of water with a compound that equally vaporizes safely at that temp.

Also you are talking about a vapor, much more diffuse compared to the liquid, if you can impart a material that will vaporize at the same point, it has to be at a density that provides adequate reactivity.

Glow materials, in particular, needs a very high ratio additive to carrier to be obviously visibly reactive under black light.


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## Otaku

Could a viable fog juice be made using tonic water and glycerine? I imagine the percentage of quinine in the tonic water would be pretty small.


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## Allen H

Otaku, yes- a fog juice could be made, but it would not glow because it is not dense enough. Like Corey said- density is key. If you use a squirt bottle filled with tonic water and spray it in front of a black light does the cloud glow? If it did then a mister set up could be used with tonic water to make a glowing mist.


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## RoxyBlue

Perhaps the experiment could be tried with an ultrasonic humidifier - no heating involved.


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## Otaku

I have one of those misters laying around (from a failed attempt at getting it to fog a cauldron). I think I'll grab a bottle of tonic water and give it a shot. I agree that density is the key, but I've had some really thick fog come out of my chillers. I have to wonder if, were it made with a tonic water/glycerine fluid, it would glow under UV. I understand all the chemistry/theory behind making fog and the hurdles involved, but has anyone actually put this to the test?


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## bfrd22

As others have said its expansion ratio's If I am correct, your looking around 1,600,000 : 1 in that 1 cubic foot of smoke fluid will produce 1,600,000 cubic feet of smoke. 

1 cubic foot just over 7 gallons.
A half decent machine and good fluid, will produce 60,000 cubic feet per hour, (3000 cubic feet per minute with a 30% duty cycle). 1 gallon of Commercial grade fluid will last 4 hrs. 

1 fluid ounce of smoke fluid will produce approx 1700 cubic feet of smoke 

your 5 drops of "glow" fluid will produce 285 cubic feet. at the same expansion ratio.


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## Lunatic

I really like the idea and brainstorming here. I'm excited about the possibilities but the production of unknown toxic chemicals concerns me. Even simple chemistry can potentially get nasty after heating it in a fogger. I still think glycol based fog juice isn't totally safe even though it's advertised so. I'm super curious about glowing fog though. I would be surprised if this couldn't be accomplished putting aside any toxic effects. 

I'm not sure about this but doesn't automobile antifreeze glow under black light? I know there is an additive that can be added to engine oil to detect where oil leaks are by using a black light. I'll have to ask my mechanic about it. I know he used on my truck before. I have an expensive optical brightener liquid additive used in water based coatings that works extremely well under black light. I could try mixing a little in fog juice and try it in my fogger just to prove the theory. But DAMN, I don't want to chance ruining one of my foggers. If I convince myself to try it then I'll post my results.


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## Revenant

Apologies in advance for what will be a very long-winded post, but I had this conversation with a professional who's been doing special effects in Hollywood for over 25 years.

The fog you see from a water-based fogger is mostly condensation from ambient atmospheric water, not fog juice. The droplets of fog fluid simply act as "seeds" for the atmospheric water to condense around. It's the water that is diffusing and reflecting most of the light, not the juice. Ever notice how haunters in humid or damp chilly environments get these thick long-lasting fog banks, but the ones in Arizona and Nevada get pretty much jack squat? It's not because the dry air is "drying up" the fog quickly, it's because very little fog is forming in the first place. The same amount of fog fluid is being vaporized and blown out, but it's so dissipated that you quickly lose sight of it.

If you're making fog with a UV reactive pigment in it... since very little of what you're seeing in the fog is actual fogger fluid, it stands to reason that only a VERY miniscule amount of "glow stuff" would actually be present, widely dispersed, in your fog. So...

1) Florescence (blacklight glow) means that the UV is causing the molecules of reactive pigment to shed visible photons.
2) Your ability to see any light is dependent on how many photons are being kicked out.
3) If you have only a tiny amount of reactive pigment dispersed throughout a large volume of air, there will not be enough photons emitted for your eyes to register them.

In short, there's just not enough light being produced to be able to see it, at least to the extent that it would be even remotely impressive. The liquid itself may glow like radioactive hellfire, but once it gets dispersed into fog, the intensity levels will simply not be visible. And if you've never played with the quinine/tonic water before, let me address your curiosity: The stuff is so dilute that the liquid itself gives only a mild glow, and its mist from an ultrasound mister (which is pure liquid) is pretty much a UV dud. In a fogger, don't waste your time.

Mixing unknown chemicals into fog juice to see what happens is *a bad idea*. There's the danger of toxic byproducts, fogger damage, and the almost certain probability that you won't get *any* result worth the effort. *Don't knock yourself out trying to overcome the weaknesses* by overpowering them; *play to the strengths*: Conventional fog -- that mixture of vaporized fog fluid droplets with atmospheric moisture condensed around them -- is very visible, and reflects light very well. Pick your favorite color of visible light, and illuminate the fog. People in Hollywood train and practice this stuff for years and make good money creating effects like this, and that's how they do it. They've been there, done that, tried the other, and they know.


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## Lunatic

Oh, what a killjoy Revenant! But a good point nonetheless. I'm not wasting my time and health on the idea. I still like the subject though but if the pros have looked at it and haven't succeeded then I'll leave the subject alone. Thanks for the post Revenant! You probably just saved my fogger from being damaged. My lighting effect for my fog looks pretty good anyway.


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## austenandrews

As Revenant said, fog already glows pretty well. It seems like the real trick is making the light that illuminates the fog not illuminate other things. If the lit fog strongly contrasts a dark environment, it'll really pop. Dark matte finishes all around!

Also make the lighting broad and diffuse, to eliminate light rays that draw the eye to the light source instead of the fog itself.


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## Lunatic

This isn't an exact fit for this thread but has anyone tried glow-in-the-dark bubbles? Maybe even to be used along with a bubble fogger. I know the the fog doesn't glow but it may look like glowing orbs.

This link shows where to buy.
http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&ke...=aps&hvadid=4528016709&ref=pd_sl_74qz3fvdxo_e


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## bfrd22

Ok, that looks cool!


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## erik1

*.....yep*

Has been tried in the pro arena for year.. No Dukes!


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## The_Caretaker

you might need to do a after treatment of some sort, where the fog is used to distribute the glow, but then you still will need to deal with the residue from the glow.


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## fontgeek

Kind of along the thoughts of the caretaker, I think you may have better luck making the ground or surface below or within the fog blacklight sensitive. It glowing will help illuminate the fog that surrounds it or sits above it.
For static fog, like the mist around Madam Leota, you migh look at using something like "angels hair"/spun glass to diffuse your light source(s) from within, below, or projected upon it.


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## Dave Leppo

Thread Bump:

I have been playing around with some ultrasonic mist makers, and got curious about the blacklight fog thing. The misters make a cool concentrated fog ultrasonically, so they don't use heat, and the fog naturally hangs in the container, or falls downward because it's not heated. 

I figured this might work better and more safely than a heated fogger to carry the UV pigment into the cloud. I made some really cool glowing blacklight water with a dismantled highlighter pen, but the fog still would not glow in blacklight, probably for the same reason mentioned above: not enough UV ink in the cloud to pick up the blacklight. The glowing water looks really cool when splattered upward by the mister, though, so I'm still going to use the effect, in this case, with a small fish tank.


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