# to do or not to do? that is the question



## naberhoodhaunts (Mar 29, 2008)

Hello all here is my dilemma, I'm a home haunter that was approached by a pro haunt. They have gone through my home haunt and liked it. they have offered to let me set up a haunt in the same building as theirs. they have a 10,000 sq. ft. haunt. They would rent the space to me. i would put up my haunt i would expand on mine to the size of around 3500 sq. ft. i would have to get my own insurance, LLC and actors. basically run it as as a separate haunt from theirs. since it would be a small haunt and price would be small enough that people would want to pay for it after paying 15 to 17 bucks for the main haunt. Do you think this is doable and still make a small profit . They have mentioned 50 cents to a dollar per ticket for the rent. they would include my haunt in their advertising, that would be a bonus i guess. They got just over 8000 patrons this year. i was thinking of 3 to 5 bucks as an admission. what do you think? I was also thinking of a charity haunt to help with the actors i could get volunteers from the charity so that cost would go down. Please what do you all think??:googly:

Thanks Joe


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## Plastic Ninja (Sep 30, 2010)

Hhhmmm... That sounds pretty good. But the main thing is, do you think you can handle going pro? It may be a good deal, but that would be the first thing.


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## Front Yard Fright (Dec 23, 2005)

Very cool! The exact same thing is going on for me... I'm having a hard time making up my mind!

Just make sure you're smart about it and get everything down in writing.

Let us know what you decide to do! Good luck!
.


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## Bone Dancer (Oct 7, 2005)

I can see where it would be hard not to be flattered by the request. It kinda sounds to me like they want to expand "the haunt" without paying for it. You would be taking all the risk and footing the bill for it, not them.
Make real sure you have a good idea about how much extra it will cost you to expand your present haunt to cover the larger space (insurance, LLC, actors, ect). The fact that they will add you to thier advertising it no big deal for them. A extra couple lines in thier ad most likely will cost them nothing. The fact that they want a cut of your ticket price also means they will make money with no risk on thier part. Frankly I would feel it should be the other way around with them paying you a cut of the total ticket take since you are paying to expand "the haunt". 
Bottom line is your footing the total bill and taking the risk and they get a cut if you do ok or not. Its a win win for them. 
Thier offer sounds to good to be true and I think it is. If you have money and time to burn then its no problem. If it were me I would say thanks but no thanks.


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## sickNtwisted (Sep 29, 2010)

Be careful, I've heard of people losing their sets and props this way.

Gonna have to agree with Bone Dancer.


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## beelce (Jul 21, 2007)

I would want my haunt to be included in the ticket price of "the Main Haunt". Seems like not too many ticket buyers will buy another ticket for a smaller "side Haunt". Also I think I would have to be included in the Main Haunt insurance policy.....
These guys sound way to greedy. After all they like your haunt because it will make their haunt look that much better....
I suggest a counter offer.


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## Jaybo (Mar 2, 2009)

Ummm....let me get this straight. You have to rent the space, provide your own insurance, provide your own actors, you don't get a cut of their tickets at all, and the only thing they offer you is to be included in their advertising.

That sounds like a crap deal. Where is the benefit of opening with these guys versus opening a haunt of your own?


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## dave the dead (Jan 31, 2007)

Bone Dancer, Beelce, Jaybo...you guys are right on target here. For the main haunt to add an attraction not only benefits them by expanding their experience, it drastically increases their take from add-on sales such as concessions, souvineers, etc. It is ridiculous for naborhoodhaunts to take on all the expenses, part of his ticket sales, and risk in order to have space to do a separate haunt. Ideal situation would be to have a single admission to both attractions, split the take AND a portion of the concessions. 

Be careful Naborhoodhaunts...it really does sound like you are being taken advantage of here.


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## RoxyBlue (Oct 6, 2008)

I have to agree with the comments already made. Risks and profits should be shared for something like this. Aside from that, if you go with the proposal as stated, you need to do the math. The estimated foot traffic is a place to start, but keep in mind that, after paying 15-17 bucks to see the main haunt, some portion of those folks will not want to pay for a second ticket.

Get an estimate for insurance costs and formation of your LLC, and go with the conservative assumption of having to pay your actors at least minimum wage for the duration of the haunting season. You also need to figure out the costs associated with expanding your current haunt from its present size. Make sure the rent includes utilities and access to bathrooms.


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## joker (Sep 25, 2007)

I see a great opportunity as well as a big risk/commitment. 

Here's some things I'd need to know the answer to before even making a counter offer.

Can you afford the expansion? 

Can you store the expansion afterwards? 

Do you have enough dependable volunteers for setup/tear down and actors to run your haunt every night they're going to be open?

How accessible is the location going to be for you to get your stuff in?
Will you have keys to the location to come and go as you please or are you going to have to work around their schedule for setup and tear down? Will there be adequate outlets for lights, props, compressors etc...?

I think a combo ticket is in both parties best interest especially if they're going to request a portion of your sales to pay for rent. If it's a combo scenario I also don't see why their insurance wouldn't cover both haunts.

Advertising as mentioned isn't really going to cost them anything to add you and their initial offer is not risk at all to them. I would bet they have a space to large for them to expand into right now. By letting you do the work and pay them out of ticket sales allows them to show growth and the money they make off of you is going to be gravy to them over there normal season.

If the location will meet my needs and I could afford the expansion and had the team to pull it off I'd counter with doing the combined advertising, combo ticket sales, insurance coverage by them and in exchange for a little slightly bigger piece of the ticket sales. Then the only money I'd really be out was what I had to come up with for the expansion which we all know can be quite an investment.

It's a lot of work to pull of a haunt and doing it in a location other than your home can add additional stress on you and your family not to mention the added expenses (i.e. gas, food, etc...)


One more thing I forgot to mention. If you decide to move forward and do this make sure you get everything in writing up front and have it as inclusive as possible. I hate that its this way, but someone's word just isn't worth what it used to be. Especially when money is on the line.


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## mroct31 (Nov 10, 2007)

Jaybo said:


> Ummm....let me get this straight. You have to rent the space, provide your own insurance, provide your own actors, you don't get a cut of their tickets at all, and the only thing they offer you is to be included in their advertising.
> 
> That sounds like a crap deal. Where is the benefit of opening with these guys versus opening a haunt of your own?


^^^Concur

How is this good for you? All of the costs fall on you except some advertising blurb. If you really want to do this I'd try to work a deal for the first year for the rent to be free to see if there is even any interest for the patrons who will be required to pay more to see a side show? Maybe work a deal that the initial cost of the tickets gets increased to cover admission to your haunt then work out a deal for your cut of the profit based on ticket sales over a certain amount. Under the proposed deal this is a win win for them and could be a lose lose for you. I'd make them sweeten the deal in your favor and if they really want you they will or else I'd tell them to take a hike! You need to negotiate like Scott Boras and remember they came to you!


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## naberhoodhaunts (Mar 29, 2008)

dave the dead said:


> Bone Dancer, Beelce, Jaybo...you guys are right on target here. For the main haunt to add an attraction not only benefits them by expanding their experience, it drastically increases their take from add-on sales such as concessions, souvineers, etc. It is ridiculous for naborhoodhaunts to take on all the expenses, part of his ticket sales, and risk in order to have space to do a separate haunt. Ideal situation would be to have a single admission to both attractions, split the take AND a portion of the concessions.
> 
> Be careful Naborhoodhaunts...it really does sound like you are being taken advantage of here.


Your all right, believe me i have had those thoughts running through my mind. I know these people i have worked with them for three years for their haunt. they have expanded the last two years. I think their original idea was to help me make the switch. after hearing me for three years bitch about wind and rain problems of my outdoor home haunt. they offered go give me a roof to put it under. It was i that brought up the question of rent ,insurance etc. and one idea was offered in a quick answer as described in the first post. all details still have to be talked about in more detail for sure.


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## naberhoodhaunts (Mar 29, 2008)

well just an update... well they havent mentioned anything since they closed the haunt.they will not commit to giving me an answer about anything. their answer to me is they do not even know if they are going to reopen this year. it all depends if they can get the same location again. well for me its to late for me to commit anything to them just dont have the time to put into something if they aren't going to commit to me. it sucks for me but learned a great lesson. if im going pro it will be on my own not with the help of people that want everything for nothing.....thanks to everyone for the input !!!


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## scareme (Aug 29, 2006)

Thanks for sharing your experience with us. It seems like so many haunters get taken advantage of. We love what we do, and are proud to share it with others. And there seems to be a lot of people out there ready to try to make money off that. Good thing we have each other to bounce ideas off of. I think we try to look out for each other around here, without trying to tell someone what to do. A fine line.


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## naberhoodhaunts (Mar 29, 2008)

well maybe sometimes we need to be told what to do...lol the forums are a great place for everyone to get info and feedback. this i s a close nit community.. home and pro haunters share a certain different look at life...in a good way that is, we are all good people for the most part. we just have a few that want to take advantage of our crafts for their own benefit and try to make it look like they are trying to help us out. glad to have so many people. to look for help or advice when i need it..so thanks to all!!!!


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## corner haunt (May 21, 2008)

I guess I will have to check out your home haunt instead this year. I do a pretty good job for my area, but nothing pro worthy. The best Rochester area haunt I saw was Fear at Frontier (4 haunts in one). Good luck on your haunt this year no matter where it is.


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## naberhoodhaunts (Mar 29, 2008)

corner haunt said:


> I guess I will have to check out your home haunt instead this year. I do a pretty good job for my area, but nothing pro worthy. The best Rochester area haunt I saw was Fear at Frontier (4 haunts in one). Good luck on your haunt this year no matter where it is.


Thanks, will have to check out yours as well. dont ever think your stuff is not pro worthy. there are a lot of pro haunts out there that make their own props. and after working in one in our area it is all in the lighting and atmosphere. the props dont have to be great the avg. person is only in front of them for a few seconds. set design is important, to give the person the feeling they are really in a morgue or graveyard or whatever the scene is. A lot of our work is pretty lame in daylight but when you put it dim lights and have scary music playing its totally diff. check out our work on facebook. naberhoodhaunts is our page.


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